“Treat your disfellowshipped loved ones as though they have been slain by Jehovah, and don’t mourn them!”

Watchtower is piling on the misery for disfellowshipped ones with its latest propaganda
Watchtower is piling on the misery for disfellowshipped ones with its latest propaganda

In what should surely rank among some of the most grotesque propaganda ever to be churned out by Watchtower’s writing department, Jehovah’s Witnesses are being asked to think of their disfellowshipped family members, not just as being dead, but as having been killed by Jehovah. As such they are not to be mourned.

“What a test of faith it was for Aaron and his family not to mourn their dead relatives!” says the latest November 15th Watchtower magazine on page 14, describing the slaughter of Aaron’s sons Nadab and Abihu through fire from heaven. “Are you personally proving yourself holy with regard to not associating with family members or others who have been disfellowshipped?”

The bizarre connection with Nadab and Abihu follows on from a similar article in 2011 in which the biblical account was invoked to guilt-trip Witness parents into avoiding “unnecessary association” with any disfellowshipped son or daughter.

“Think of how [Aaron] must have felt when his sons Nadab and Abihu offered illegitimate fire to Jehovah and He struck them dead. Of course, that ended any association those men could have had with their parents… The message is clear. Our love for Jehovah must be stronger than our love for unfaithful family members.” (w11 7/15 p.32)

It should go without saying that in order to invoke the direct slaughter of miscreants by God in justifying the total shunning of any who leave a religion, you first need to provide unequivocal proof that the religion in question is solely endorsed by God – a claim that virtually all religions make.

Watchtower has yet to write anything that comes close to offering tangible evidence of divine backing. It merely asks Witnesses to believe that Jesus made an invisible sojourn to Earth between 1914 and 1919, and used this period to ‘cleanse’ and select an organization he is apparently still ‘cleansing’ to this day – the Watch Tower Society.

The total vacuum of evidence to support Watchtower’s claims of divine direction make any attempted parallels with bible accounts of divine execution and excommunication both absurd and obscene.

If only Watchtower could rediscover some of the logic and reasonableness that led it to conclude in a 1947 Awake! article that the practice of disfellowshipping (or “excommunication”) is an instrument of “ecclesiastical power and secular tyranny” that is “altogether foreign to biblical teachings.”

The 1947 article can be downloaded on these links: Page 1 | Page 2

Instead, Witnesses are bombarded with manipulative dogma (centered around a flawed understanding of 1 Cor. 5:11) aimed at dismantling families for the sake of Watchtower’s interests. Even the sending of emails to disfellowshipped ones is prohibited according to another recent magazine.

“Do not look for excuses to associate with a disfellowshipped family member, for example, through e-mail.” (w13 1/15 p.16 par. 19)

Though it may be easy for Watchtower’s cloistered Governing Body and its army of writers to spew forth this outrageous material, the effects on ordinary people who simply want to leave a religion they have discovered to be false are all too tangible, as this question in our latest 2014 Global Survey shows.

shunning pollAs reassuring as it is that 23% of disfellowshipped/disassociated ones answering the above question say they are NOT shunned by family members, that number is not likely to rise given the steady stream of coercion flowing from Brooklyn.

I personally believe there will come a time when all religious organizations who seek tax exempt or charitable status will be answerable to Article 18 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which recognizes an individual’s innate right to “change his religion or belief.”

But as Watchtower presses forward with its efforts to deprive people of this basic right through its immoral shunning policies with an almost sadistic fervor, such a time cannot come soon enough.

 

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Further reading…

272 thoughts on ““Treat your disfellowshipped loved ones as though they have been slain by Jehovah, and don’t mourn them!”

  • August 27, 2014 at 3:26 am
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    Hello to all, watchtower is a deadly poison. Dilute it to its smallest part and it is still a deadly poison. My life is in ruins as is my health due to the barbaric indoctrination of shunning. In fact apart from freedom to think as a sentient being my life has changed into something I do not like. My wife of 25 years and my children do not even acknowledge my presence by word or deed. Yes I am angry and I get sick to the stomach when someone insults so many by supporting this evil cult. I am unable to use the language of my choice to say exactly how I feel toward anything vaguely tied to watchtower. Most of you guy`s and ladies would not understand Gaelic! :) Frankly I am sometimes amazed that watchtower HQ is still standing. I would like to feel that I was doing something to wake people up to realize that watchtower is evil, bad to the bone. Lately watchtower had yet another go at one of its former benefactors, the UN. Just how many people and institutions can you abuse with relative impunity? If I were to stand outside the headquarters of the UN with a sign proclaiming it to be “The Beast” I would be arrested or sectioned. The Brooklyn Dodgers continue to speak grandiose judgements on people and on the UN. There are many excellent sites such as this where we can learn and vent our spleen. Being Irish I would like to see a more militant approach being organized against watchtower. I am not making a case for violence, protest yes and perhaps more. Organize to picket kingdom halls, branches and HQ. I am sure that there are a number of lawyers that are now ex jw. By the letters written here on John`s website there are minds finer than mine. I would like to know how far we could legally go to put watchtower in the public eye. Watchtower goes to extremes based on falsehood and super egotism. Each day I wake and watchtower is still here is a bad day. They have millions of prisoners and actively seek new captives to coerce and brainwash. I live in a small town in the south west of Ireland. I have died so many times when my three children pass me by on its streets. Yes I am very angry and I am thankful being 56 and not 36 because my temperament has mellowed somewhat with age. Cedars keep up the good work and I thank you for the privilege of blowing of steam here.

    Jerry.

  • August 27, 2014 at 5:17 am
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    Jerry. You said: “Lately watchtower had yet another go at one of its former benefactors, the UN.” The WT is still a benefactor of the UN, through the OSCE, which is described as one of the ‘closest partners’ of the UN on its website.

    On jw.org you will find articles of supposed JW victories for their ‘right’ to preach freely in certain east European countries. These have been won using the clout of the OSCE. Of course, jw.org does not mention the OSCE’s involvement.

    If you go to the OSCE website and enter the word ‘Jehovah’ into the search box, you can see for yourself that the WT makes submissions to this organisation asking for its help. You are correct in highlighting the WT’s hypocrisy with its involvement with the UN for over 20 years, at the same time slandering it with its peculiar interpretation of Revelation and pronouncing its imminent destruction by God.

    I feel for you and your situation. You are not alone.

    • August 27, 2014 at 5:59 am
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      Jimmy thank you so much for the encouragement and for the info on the OSCE. Yes my life sucks but it could be so much worse. To use my right as a human to decide what I will watch, listen, wear, talk of, drink, eat, read, surf, empathize and smoke more than makes it all worthwhile. Once again my sincere thanks to you Jimmy and to John.

      Jerry.

  • August 27, 2014 at 6:37 am
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    @ Jerry O Connor. I live for the day when the Watchtower is exposed for what it really is, an evil, God dishonoring cult!!

  • August 27, 2014 at 7:09 am
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    Hi anonymous it seems that exposure just will not cut it. We know what they are as do many others who have never been brainwashed. You are so right, it is evil pure unadulterated evil at that. There is no doubt that it will eventually fall. I just hope that I am above the ground to see it so. I searched my scattered wits to find a word that describes watchtower best to me. After much deliberation I finally settled on SINISTER! Now I do have other words but they will not get past the censor. :) You seem to have held on to God and even though I am an atheist I wish you well.

    Jerry.

  • August 27, 2014 at 7:25 am
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    Hi Jerry. If there is a God, which I don’t know either anymore, is that I wished he’d answer our prayers, concerning the exposure of the Watchtower. I also wish to live that long.

  • August 27, 2014 at 10:16 am
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    Jerry,

    I empathise with your situation.

    If you want to challenge the WTBTS, then a good start would be to download the “Shepherding the Flock of God” book from the internet.

    It is the “secret elders’ manual” and it is of great use to expose the mechanics of the cult.

    If your wife lives with you, then she has no WT sanction to shun you. You are still her head, according to the WT rule book. I won’t pry, but that book will help you with the official rules on shunning.

    I sympathise with your desire to picket, and I won’t try to dissuade you if you feel that is the right thing to do.

    It has merit, but the downside is that the WTBTS will spin any picketing into the fantasy that they are being persecuted by Satan’s hordes!

    I’m sure that the Republic of Ireland will have some kind of regulator for charities. With the knowledge you gain from the “Shepherding” book, a complaint to them will eventually hit the WTBTS in the wallet, where it REALLY hurts, because they will lose the lucrative tax rebates.

    It’s just one way that you can stand up for your rights as a human being. It isn’t the best and I am only offering a way to protest.

    I hope that the community here will help you. We want to.

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • August 27, 2014 at 10:59 am
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    Hello Excelsior I thank you for your kind words and pointing me toward the shepherding book. Unfortunately my family pressurised me to leave my home of 22 years. To say my life has changed is an under statement. Even on “good” day`s it sucks beyond belief and I find it so hard to find a reason to continue. I am on meds for depression, anxiety and hyper tension. I never knew loneliness until my family decided to eject me from my home. I could legally have stayed but with no one talking to me I saw no point. As usual with X jws all of my fair weather friends are gone. I would like to say that I am optimistic for the future but in truth this is not so. At present I take it from minute to minute and boy are they ever long! Nights are spent in a vain attempt to find comfort in the arms of Morpheus. I have not had a drink in many year but right now it looks just awesomely beautiful. Pride is the only thing keeping the plug in the jug but I doubt it will last. I find that I am drawn to the saddest films and music which maybe an Irish thing. I have forgotten how to smile and laughter has become a stranger. I do not live in the truest sense I just exist and endure. Watchtower has basically pronounced a death sentence for me with their cruel and unusual dogma. I would find it very difficult not to get extremely physical if I were to meet an elder from the Tralee congregation. Right now I am very unstable mentally and I can not say what will develop. Once again I thank Excelsior and Cedars for allowing me to pour my anguish on you all.

    Jerry

  • August 27, 2014 at 11:30 am
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    My Daughter. Attended one of the assemblies, that took
    place last weekend. She told me of a talk, that centred
    on the importance of the family, and why we should not
    cut off unbelieving relatives. The speaker used the
    Illustration of a “surgeon amputating a limb” and how
    that limb would not re attatch itself.

    I’m afraid I found it impossible to conceal my disgust
    at such unctuous ness. Weasel words, to distance
    themselves from the emotional damage their shunning
    policy has caused, and worse still, family members
    permanently cut off, by suicide.

  • August 27, 2014 at 11:44 am
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    Jerry

    You are not alone, please be assured that there are many here on this site who feel as angry as you do with Watchtower for tearing their family away from them. I am one and I too long for the day when Watchtower is exposed.

    When I was disfellowshipped I was so isolated from all my family, and former so-called friends from the Cong went out of their way to turn their backs upon me. I later discovered that the perception was that by becoming an ex-JW I would turn to drugs, alcohol and lead a reckless and debauched lifestyle without the “loving hand of the Organisation” to control me.

    Over 20yrs later, their blinkered views were proved unfounded. The initial trauma of leaving the Org did not last. I am a respectable member of society, I own property, have a career etc and most importantly I am happy. (Except for the situation with my family, but I do my best to focus on living my life and not dwell upon it to the extent that I let it eat away at me).

    Funnily enough some of those very JWs who once crossed the street to avoid me, now go out of their way to stop and chat to me, even though I never showed the slightest inclination to return. (Not that it really matters to me now whether they speak to me or not).

    It is horrible to feel alone, but please try to stay strong and don’t give them any ammunition to use against you. Things can get better.

    There is help available for ex-JWs on Cedars links and you have the assurance too that many others here on JW-Survey are in similar situations.

    You are in our thoughts.

  • August 27, 2014 at 12:06 pm
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    Hi Jerry. When I was young, I almost committed suicide because of the Watchtower religion. I changed my mind within time and went to the hospital for help. I am so glad that I didn’t let them do that to me. The price is too high.

    We only have one chance at life and believe it or not, you can go on. I am feeling the shunning in my local small town because I won’t go in service or meetings for the last 3 months. I keep looking at videos on Youtube and watch them over and over again to fortify myself that I am right and they are all wrong and wasting their lives.

    What helps me is to write. When I found jwsurvey, it gave me the opportunity to spill my guts as well and that has been a godsend to me through this means. We all have to have somebody to talk to and in the organization, we are not allowed to talk to anybody for help. That is why I went on the internet to find help for the situation I am in. I was also at the point of suicide last summer and I love my kids enough that I wouldn’t ever want them to have to go through that. My father committed suicide in 1996 and when a loved one commits suicide, it’s worse than if a stranger had taken a gun and killed them or if they had died from cancer or something. When somebody you love takes their own life, it is the worst pain a loved family member can go through. Take it from me. Don’t do that to your family. They are doing what they think is going to make you “come to your senses” and want their company enough that you will come back into the “truth” and be saved through Armageddon. They think they are saving your life by doing that.

    The ones that we should hate are the people responsible and that is the lying, cheating Governing Body who are such cowards that they can’t come clean with the truth that they are not and never have been appointed by God as his spokesmen on earth. They all should be thrown in jail. That is where they all belong. But in the meantime, all we can do is hope that there is enough of an avalanche of Youtube videos that will wake up more and more people that the Watchtower either has to admit the truth about themselves or more and more people will refuse to fund them and they have to go under. Hang in there. Life will get better for you. Don’t let them win!!!

  • August 27, 2014 at 1:44 pm
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    @anonymous: I agree that the GB is culpable. However, I also believe that to a degree, they are also victims of their own religion, just as every JW is. At different times in my life I was shunned; at other times, I did the shunning. I had conflicting feelings. On the one hand, my gut told me something was WRONG. On the other hand, my training told me that I was doing “the right thing.” :( Hence, the cognitive dissonance.
    At our cores, we are all, both current JW and ex-JW, just PEOPLE. One of the fundamental things that stuck with me from my JW days is this, because it is an enduring principle that predates JWs: “Love never fails.”
    My wife and I just had her JW family over–parents and sibling. We are as yet only “inactive” for the past year, and her folks know why, to a large extent. I am sure some of them feel sorry for us, because we are “lost.” We feel sorry for THEM, because they are in prison!
    The above is in no way intended to take away from the fact that a great deal of pain has been caused by WT policies, and believe me, my wife and I have felt the full force of it over the years at different times.
    Hang in there, brothers and sisters on this site. I feel a kinship with you that I feel at no other place.

  • August 27, 2014 at 2:45 pm
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    @PureStrongHeart. I think that when the men on the Governing Body were pioneers and circuit overseers, they were also victims and sincerely loved God, just as Ray Franz did. I agree with you and I’d hate to be in the position that they are in. What I hate more than that though, is the position that all the rest of us are in when we see the real truth behind the “curtain”.

    The very least they can do is apologize and rewrite the disfellowshipping and blood policy. They can do that much and still save face. We are for the most part a very understanding and forgiving people and we could understand the position they have been put in when they became members of the Governing Body. If they are stubbornly refusing, then they are more concerned about themselves and their pride, than they are about all the pain that their disfellowshipping and blood policy has caused for millions of people and for that reason, I have zero respect for them.

  • August 27, 2014 at 8:44 pm
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    @ anonymous: Well said!
    I try to imagine and put myself in the shoes of a GB member. They must feel the cognitive dissonance too, on some level. On the one hand, they still believe. On the other hand, they see the “politics” behind the curtain. I imagine that much of what they do is fear based. “What will happen if we don’t hold it all together?” The most fearful thing is not following precedence and the past edicts of former GB members. This has led to the morass they are in now, for example the convoluted, incomprehensible blood doctrine. Part of them must feel that a great heavy Elijah-like mantle of authority has been set upon their shoulders. Another part of them must see the great level of unspiritual nonsense behind the scenes, and with it the great damage it does. :(
    Decades of doing little else but reading the Watchtower, attending meetings, and preaching door to door has left an intellectual desert and an pseudo-academic inbreeding amongst JWs that the GB is just as much a victim and party to as much as the rank and file.
    What will happen to the WTBTS? It is hard to imagine an implosion and a mainstreaming along the lines of Herbert Armstrong’s Worldwide Church of God, but I suppose anything is possible.

  • August 28, 2014 at 6:31 am
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    There is a legal way for the GB to get out of this conundrum. Jehovah’s Witnesses in the UK are a merger between The Watchtower Society (U.S) and the International Bible Students Association (G.B).

    Call on the GB to disfellowship and Shun the Watchtower Society for all its Crackpot Doctrine.. that has led the likes of Jerry to the edge of despair, for its lack of humanity.

    Reinvent the Wheel… remove the rust and polish up a New Invention from an old Machine.

    Return to being Bible Students… wasn’t that what most of the dedicated ones thought we were in the first place?

    I was always told that Watchtower worked for Us… not the other way round.. that it was a mere tool to get the job done, and would be dismantled as a work horse in the New System. It has become a two-headed wild beast in its own right. The only way to kill a dilemma is to chop off one of its necks!

    Then a “Pure” form of worship can survive…and, it will sort out the “men from the boys..”

    Keep the plug in the jug, Jerry! For god sake, focus man. You are better than they are.

    Happiness is like a butterfly… the more you chase it.. the more elusive it gets. Ignore the chase, and just let happiness come settle on your shoulder. Slainte! (gallic)

    • August 28, 2014 at 6:42 am
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      Gem – The International Bible Students still exist in the US as a religion.

    • August 28, 2014 at 8:19 am
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      Gem I am in complete agreement with Excelsior. I have very sound reasons for this. Watchtower dismantled my life as I knew it. Unfortunately there are many more in their thousands with a story close or even worse than mine. Watchtower`s policy on shunning is appalling. Their complete indifference with predatory paedophile`s beggars belief. Spousal abuse is rife and women are supposed to wait on a god that does not exist! You come to terms of sorts with being shunned. But the defenceless children are traumatized threefold. First the horror of the act itself and then doubting parents. Last of all the so called elders who are put out that a child would cause such trouble for the congregation`s “good name”. Now vector in watchtower`s penchant for lying since its inception and you have a very sinister cult. Putting a different name on them will not change a single barbaric policy. I can not tolerate watchtower apologists. Which part of the third Reich should have been allowed to remain? One was, the other is a super high control despotic and inhumane cult. Do not be misled, watchtower is evil incarnate and deserving of doing serious jail time. If I had my way the GB would be taken out and shot. Religion has a track record of causing mankind unspeakable horrors. Watchtower has even out done some of the many that they derided and considering Catholicism this is no mean feat. Yes religion is a snare and a racket. What thinking person would get involved with any religion. I am sick to death of hearing that there is some “good” in all religions. Good people do not rape children or murder them because they have a no blood rule. Likewise they do not beat their wives. In the North American Continent there are over 22,000 paedophiles registered not with the police but with watchtower. Their is no way this should be tolerated or am I seeing things wrong? Thanks to Cedar`s and more like him the facts are out in the open. it is my dearest hope that something will be done to hurry watchtower to its inevitable end.

      Jerry

      • August 28, 2014 at 11:04 am
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        Jerry
        As a victim of child abuse, not by a congregation member but by a family member who went on to become an elder , id like to know where that stat (22,000 abusers) can be found. thanks , its important

        • August 28, 2014 at 12:13 pm
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          Hello Da` the list is in watchtower HQ Brooklyn. I will try to find the link to the Panorama show that exposed this fact. I am so sorry to hear that you were a victim of a crime worse than murder.

          Jerry.

          • August 29, 2014 at 6:13 am
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            Jerry
            Thank you for getting back/ Ill wait for the link

  • August 28, 2014 at 7:13 am
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    GEM,

    Would these “Bible Students” be a separate church from the religion with the same name in America? That name is taken! Think of the copyright issues!

    You don’t seem to understand what I am saying, for which I apologise. Let me try a different way, and see if you will see things as I see them.

    Disfellowshipping the WT would achieve nothing. It is merely a legal label for an organisation.

    Let me illustrate. The Emporer of the Galaxy, Palpatine (Star Wars references coming up!) has an image problem. The people just don’t like being pushed around and being told what to do! He creates a Death Star, to finally put paid to all this grumbling. To brighten his image, he decides to re-name the Death Star. He renames it the Freedom Sphere, and everybody is still being threatened by a gigantic space station with a stocking great planet bloweruper on it!

    My convoluted point is this:

    It doesn’t matter what you call the JWs! You can call them bible students or whatever your imagination can contrive.

    If the SUBSTANCE and POLOCIES don’t change, then it’s just like renaming the Death Star the Freedom Sphere!

    It’s the same religion as before!

    GEM,

    This post is about the terrible emotional and psychological harm that shunning does. It’s about the ramping up, yet again, of the WTBTS’ shunning travesty. Would these “Bible Students” have the same policy?

    Would they recant the two witness rule as regards child abuse cases? Would they acknowledge their guilt and settle with the victims?

    The policies are what these articles are about, GEM.

    Please explain to me the policies of this new religion as regards shunning, child abuse policy and cover ups, domestic violence policy and cover ups and how transparent the finances of this new religion would be?

    I look forward to your response.

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • August 28, 2014 at 8:27 am
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    @Excelsior: No dispute there my friend. If you re read my post, I referred to Watchtower Crackpot doctrine.

    Look at the history of the I.B.S.A and further into the History of WT publishing association and you will see an historic merger.

    What I am saying is that it could be possible to separate these two entities, abandon the said Crackpot Policies and reinstate, sound doctrine and policy. I have no time for these policies of shunning, child abuse and cover ups…

    Remember I am an old timer to the Movement… much has changed for the worse during these past 30 years.

    All the best to Jerry from all of us that have been at the sharp end of those policies

  • August 28, 2014 at 8:59 am
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    Its a Cult and its only really until you leave it and this is not with out pain to say the least, you see what its really made of, fear indoctrinating on the basis of a supernatural entity which MAN(Governing Body) says will be unhappy if you don’t obey the teachings which are taught from MAN and dictated from MAN…..now i feel that comes under the category of a a cult because Man is the leader not God in this wholesome Organization which deems to love and care!!!!..but sadly destroys family,s and friendships,to the point some have taken there life,s, when will it be the time to see the organization,Governing Body,Watchtower..or what ever there changing there name to will stand Guilty as Blood Guilty…..as Charged!!

  • August 28, 2014 at 3:32 pm
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    You’ve got to make a new life for yourself, and believe that you can. Go take a class, join some local groups, like dance classes, photography groups, groups for anything you ever wanted to learn about but didn’t have the time.

    Fill your life with new things and soon you’ll be surrounded by real friends, who won’t cast you aside just because you change your beliefs.

  • August 28, 2014 at 11:37 pm
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    Terence I am 56 years old and I do have some life experience. I have waded through too much s^*t in this length of time. Do you really think that joining a dance club will solve my problems? Talk about over simplification! Perhaps a chess club or maybe a bridge club would open up blissful vistas? Dancing, playing cards, chess will never replace my family, my home or my life! Terence I want to shake you and ask you are you for real man? Walk a distance in my shoes and then see if you feel like dancing!

    Jerry…….extremely angry!

  • August 29, 2014 at 12:53 am
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    If is any conciliation Jerry i lived in Ireland in West Cork and had many friends from Cork city right down the coast and Cobh to but when i was Dissfelowshiped for the grounds of questioning,which was done in UK,it got back to Ireland and there were others who treated me disgusting never mind shunning,i was well known right as far back as when the assembles were in Navan which is going back some time,its disgusting to say the least the shunning but i can not beg to believe the hurt your going through,even till this day when i go back to Ireland i still see JW in Cork or west Cork Bantry who were my friends for many years but i,am treated like some walking contagious disease,as i still work on Bantry market when i visit Ireland and get this treatment from people i have known since i was 19 and i,am now 45 years old…hurt is not the word but family members would hurt even more…Jerry its like a grieving process or what i call the bargaining period and hell it hurts with anger and questioning even your self,i too had depression and very severe to the point of admission to hospital,no one on this site can say they no how you feel but can understand the anger and hurt it can cause,please believe me time is a good healer not on your side but i feel on the family’s side,there is a point which will come when may be your children will question as they would normally,what i found is that its not a persons full intention to shun but whats being indoctrinated to them is the problem,Jerry i do not no what else to say,all i no is how things effected me and now iam going through a Divorce from my JW wife which i will say has been instigated from those who feel there doing the lords work,elders,busy bodys ect,and at present i feel angry and disowned to a point i feel a Dance group or chess group would be the last thing to Join,but i feel the persons good intentions were there,Take Care Jerry…Dean Smith

  • August 29, 2014 at 2:14 am
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    GEM,

    I appreciate your point, but it won’t work.

    You would still have the same people doing the same things unless you had a cut off point. And what would you do with the historic cases?

    I’m afraid your idea won’t fly.

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • August 29, 2014 at 3:21 am
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    Hi Jerry. Don’t be angry at Terance. He’s just trying to help as all the rest of us on this site. I am 68 and have been a Witnesses since I was 19. The ones you need to be angry with are the Governing Body. They are the ones that taught all of us to be psychopaths in having no “natural affection” as 2nd Timothy says. We were all taught to put the organization above all else even our own families. I also shunned in the name of the organization, thinking it was God’s will. They have been brainwashed and can’t think straight. If you can move out of the area, that’s what I’d do if I could if I were in your place. I can’t move and the only friends I have here are Witnesses and I can’t talk to them about how they are being deceived and it is hard to sleep at night, feeling so isolated from them. \

    So far I haven’t been disfellowshipped but if I was, I’d send a letter to every one of them, outlining just why I left and how they have been deceived etc. At least they’d know what really happened and not have to guess.

    I don’t believe in disfellowshipping but sometimes it can force a person to be a good person, such as not gambling the family’s income away or not to beat on a man’s wife. You mentioned you have a problem with drinking. Are you in any way at fault at all over your disfellowshipping? If so, you need to take responsibility for it. If you were kicked out because you disassociated yourself, then that’s a totally different case. There is no way in h*** that your family should shun you because you disassociated yourself. I went to annointedjw and there’s a scenario where what would happen if the Society suddenly said that we could all talk to our disfellowshipped family members again, and one scene, the mother and father had shunned their daughter for 8 years and now the Society said they could talk to their daughter. When they went to see their daughter and their granddaughter, the daughter had been so hurt by their shunning that the table was turned and she no longer wanted anything to do with them since they had put the rules of 7 men in New York over the “natural affection” they should have had for their daughter over and above her and their granddaughter. I know that if one of my children got disfellowshipped, I’d listen to their side of the story.

    Everyone in this organization is taught to be psychopaths. That’s the only way you can let your own child die because they needed a transfusion. That’s the only way a person can shun their own family. It’s the same as if you were slaughtering animals for a living dissect bodies as a coroner. You get used to the thought of Jehovah’s killing even innocent babies at Armageddon. We all shunned and you probably did too. All we can do now is hope that there are enough people on the internet that are exposing the underbelly of the Society that soon, within our lifetimes, we see the end of the beast, called the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society. In the meantime, we have to go through a grieving process and that takes time.

    It would be nice if your family would not be in walk-step with the Organization but it may never happen. They are also in straight jackets. You show them love and in the end, it is they who may come back to you and apologize.

    If something happens to them in some kind of rejection by the Organization, they may come to your way of thinking. It’s not that we want anything bad to happen to them but the more that are on the outside looking in, the more of us that can support each other and the easier it gets.

    One thing I would encourage you to do though is to open up all the window shades in your house. Get sunlight into your place and stop watching sad stories. Don’t watch anything unless it’s funny. I can’t stand to watch anything that’s not funny and the first thing I do is open up all the shades. We are all trying to help you here, not make it worse for you. We are all going through the same thing and we understand what you are going through.

  • August 29, 2014 at 4:24 am
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    Jerry,
    I am somehow astonished at your reprimand of Terence. You did as if he proposed some obscenity, and yet he just gave kind and very sensible advice.

    Surely you didn’t come here and open up like you did just to get the “oh we are so very very sorry for your situation” responses? Probably almost all people here have their reasons to be here – may it be shunning, depression, abuse and else. No need to lash out like this, really.

  • August 29, 2014 at 7:00 am
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    Jerry.

    Terrance had empathy for you. He thought of some things that
    that he considered might be helpful to you and took the trouble
    post. You were harsh on him man.

  • August 29, 2014 at 7:03 am
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    Folks,

    We all want to help Jerry. Jerry, please don’t take offence at some of the advice that has been given to you.

    anonymous,

    I respect your opinion, but I do not believe that disfellowshipping stops domestic abuse or problem gambling, oh that it did.

    Disfellowshipping is a weapon used to control people. If someone is guilty of domestic violence, then they need to be in jail, not hanging their head at the back of the Kingdom Hall! If someone has a problem with gambling, they need professional help, not the judgement of other people.

    We normally agree on things, but I thought I would share my secular opinion on this issue. I know that you are a good person.

    Jerry, we are here to help if we can. Download that elder’s book and check the shunning policies. See if your family is following them as directed.

    Your personal issues are……personal. I want to help you wade through all the nonsense and fear that the WTBTS generates.

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • August 29, 2014 at 7:22 am
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    This is my final post on this excellent website. I was never posting to attract the sympathy vote. Some of you fail to see why I was angry at Terrence. Life goes on according to Terrence. What life? Playing cards and dancing sound banal to me. Do you think that I would say Eureka? Jesus wept if you believe that garbage. I live in a very real world of hurt and it is strange when others are uncomfortable with my pain. I sympathize with you! Cedars it has been a pleasure.

    Jerry.

    • August 29, 2014 at 7:27 am
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      I would be the last person to suggest that you take up dancing. But do not dismiss the therapeutic value of dancing as ‘garbage’ It is not. Not only do I and millions of others find it uplifting; it was actually recommended by several speakers at a weekend conference on ‘undue influence’ aka ‘mind control’. Many of the participants at the conference were ex JWs

    • August 29, 2014 at 7:43 am
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      Jerry –
      I have been viewing all comments on this topic (treat as slain by jah) im abit bewildered by all the back and forth. I don’t believe anyone meant any harm , but feeling the blows of being df’d or da’d (as I have), WHATEVER you decide , of all the websites, this is surely a comforting one to visit. so… just know it does get better (really, I think that’s all they are saying). My children (4) at first didn’t know what to do , as they were also being pumped by an extremely vindictive ex. But they soon came around and now view him as a real piece of garbage (and btw , many of his former elder friends do too) . You need to give this TIME. Be the “Christian” in this issue.

  • August 29, 2014 at 7:42 am
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    Hi Jerry. We are here to help you. Please be assured of that. We are all going through our own hell. A lot of us on the web site are also going through real pain and we are here to help each other.

    Excelsior, I didn’t mean to be glib about disfellowshipping. I also don’t believe in it and also feel that a person needs to be in jail if they abuse their wives but sometimes there are some women who won’t turn in their husbands to the authorities and this is why. What happens when a woman throws her husband in jail for abusing her is to leave her on her own and she’s has to support her and her children by herself and this can put a terrible burden on her and the kids and then the kids’ father is a “jail bird” and they will suffer terrible shame because of that. There are many reasons why a woman can’t just turn her abusive husband into the police and sometimes the elders’ threat of disfellowshipping can stop this terrible situation. I don’t argue the point at all what you are saying about shunning, but sometimes there are reasons why the elders can help in a situation like that. The kind of shunning that I am against the most, is shunning a person for disassociating oneself from the organization. I think in a case where a person’s behavior clearly is a danger to himself (drinking) or to others, then there is a place for shunning, if for nothing else to help that person stop their bad behavior. I am not talking about breaking man-made rules and that doesn’t mean that I am a Bible thumper either and that doesn’t mean that I think that the Org. is God’s organization either because that’s the last thing I’d say.

    • August 29, 2014 at 10:16 am
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      The risk of bringing the abuse to light with the elders is that it may cause the husband to be disfellowshipped for real? Unfortunately, if this happens, this as well means that the family as a whole may be shunned to some extent. Visiting becomes a little troublesome if one of the household “has” to be shunned. At meetings one may arrive late, and leave early; so all of family may have little social interaction with the rest of the congregation. I don’t envy these women at all facing this situation!

      • August 29, 2014 at 11:03 am
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        Gareth
        great point regarding the family also getting the business !
        There’s no doubt that can and will happen , as it happens to the families of elders who cause problems to other elders and their families. As a former wife of an elder, I always knew when he (my ex elder) was causing issues for other elders and their families. We were largely ignored and treated coldly by other elders because our “head”, loved to “lord it over” and continually admonish other families in the congregation , including the elders. Finally, the day came when our children became teens and then gave the elders a reason to give their dad a taste of his own medicine.

        • August 29, 2014 at 11:55 am
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          Indeed, but elders will then respond with: “But they have no reason to treat you coldly and ignore you! It’s not scriptural!” Hello black-and-white view! *Sigh*

  • August 29, 2014 at 8:08 am
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    Hi Excelsior. I have another reason and take it from me who had this experience in my life. If you are a woman in the organization and your husband physically abuses you and he is in good standing (worse if an elder or ministerial servant) and he denies it and you take it to the police, the wife is the one that won’t be believed and she is the one that will be called before the committee for lying about her husband and making the Org. look bad.

    We women know what we are up against and unless we have 2 witnesses to the abuse, our goose is cooked and we either have to get out and take the abuse that comes with it or stay and take the abuse that comes with it. We need two witnesses to the abuse and what husband is going to beat on his wife when there’s witnesses. If the husband is not a Witness, then the elders don’t care one way or the other if the wife turns in her abusive husband, but where is the money going to come from then when she has to make a living for herself and her children if there are children at home? Most women stay in those abusive relationships because they have to. They don’t have a choice.

  • August 29, 2014 at 9:27 am
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    anomymous,

    I defer to your greater experience of the sexism in the WTBTS. No offence was meant and I never want to belittle the awful situation women find themselves in when influence of the WTBTS.

    My point is that the moral situation is wrong. A woman should not be faced with decisions as you describe. It is simply wrong.

    The WTBTS should be backing women in these situations. Christ was not sexist, neither was he abusive. There should be no succour provided to domestic abusers and professional help should be provided to problem gamblers.

    If the best the WTBTS can do is force women to live in abusive relationships then what use are they?

    We agree that domestic abuse and other forms of coercion against women are wrong. I thank you for giving me an insight into the choices these abused women are forced to take.

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • August 29, 2014 at 10:09 am
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    Jerry, I wish I could have posted this before you left. Jerry and everyone here: Remember that even though we disagree with the WTS and GB philosophy, we are still dealing with loved ones that are brainwashed by this despicable and arrogant cult. Hate and anger are a horrible burden for us to carry. That’s why forgiveness is not just for the other person, it is for us too. We are the artists of our own canvases. Each of us has the free will and right to do as we wish, whether it is right, wrong, legal, or illegal. We have to accept the responsibility for our actions. I’ve done bad ‘sins’ myself and will continue to do so. That’s just part of being human. Unfairly, we have to bear the burden for other’s actions and beliefs as well. Life isn’t fair and never was designed to be in the first place! Some of us here may be trite in saying, ‘just go do something else.’ As trite as that sounds, it may be good advice. We can’t do a thing about what others say or do, but we can make a stand for ourselves and choose how to respond. The WTS baloney caused the divorce with my second wife that I am going through now, and I also take responsibility for a lot of it too! I will not get to retire on time now because of it. I could burn an ulcer over it, kill myself, or I could refuse to let it get the best of me. Don’t burden yourselves with hate, make a plan to live life that you have now. It is OK to grieve the loss of your family, friends, childhood, etc. However, not one of us can turn back time to change it. We can only CHOOSE to make a plan, go forward, and to also help others that are down.

  • August 29, 2014 at 10:26 am
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    Searcher, agreed. Although dancing may sound frivolous and may feel like putting on a mask and downplaying the seriousness of the matter; the advice could also be simpler things. For me, taking a long walk and cycling helped a lot. Just “be”… you know? Or choose someplace where you can sit or comfortably stand and watch people going about doing their thing. E.g. a city center, an airport, a train station, etc. You see children smiling/playing etc and this can be painful (missing your own), but it can also lighten your mood. Seeing life “alive”, if you get what I mean. Whatever works for you.

  • August 29, 2014 at 10:39 am
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    “Treat your disfellowshipped relatives as if they were already “murdered”
    by Jehovah”. The W,T, writers used the quaint old fashioned word,
    “Slain” it sounds a bit less shocking than Murdered, a bit more sanitised!
    but both words mean the same thing.

    In view of all the warnings about apostate thinking, it seems clear that these
    instructions are directed, not at those who are disfellowshipped for fornication
    and such, but against dissenters. The people who have realised this is not
    God’s organization and can present facts to prove it,

    The motive is, maintaining control, which is getting more tenuous all the time,
    hence the ratching up of the rhetoric.

  • August 29, 2014 at 6:00 pm
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    Yes Jehovah slew the sons of Korah directly but this is not so by any one disfellowshipped by elders/humans on earth. So to liken anyone disfellowshipped as being slain by Jehovah is false reasoning and quite untrue. How do they get away with it? This is just to reinforce the GB’s power over the rank and file. Fortunately many are sensible enough to see through this and ignore it. But there will be more hurt and more damage caused to many innocent family members and that is (almost) unforgivable.

  • August 30, 2014 at 1:06 am
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    da’
    I’ve been there as the daughter of a strict elder. We were never fully accepted by the other cong members.

    I once overheard a group of MS and an elder making cruel and derogatory remarks about my mother – who was more Christian than anyone. Anything they could use against me (however innocent it actually was) the cong members took great delight in making a fuss about to get their own back. They made my life miserable!

    In fact I was diagnosed with depression as a teenager and during this time I frequently thought about ending my life.

    As a result I chose the only way open to me that I knew to escape from the Org – and draconian as it may seem, that was to let them disfellowship me. (Fading was not an option.)

    They had no witnesses as to my alleged sin that a MS reported me to the Elders for, (the MS was at this time, unbeknownst to anyone, having an affair with another elders wife); but when I sat in front of the absolutely disgraceful JC that followed, I saw the opportunity and let them go ahead and df me.

    Despite the hell that followed, I was just thankful to be free and since leaving, although I grieve the loss of my family, I never once had suicidal thoughts.

    As for disfellowshipping – well given that I have no beliefs in The Org at all – it is a corrupt publishing company, a Cult; therefore the act of disfellowshipping is completely invalid and means absolutely nothing.

    My one regret about this whole unhappy chapter of my life was getting baptised as a young teenager. My motive for getting baptised had absolutely nothing to do with God, I just thought it might make me more accepted by the other brothers and sisters! Big Mistake!

    • August 30, 2014 at 8:45 am
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      Rosie –
      well, our experiences sound so alike. First, being the daughter of an elder and have a mother who pioneered, bad combo. My parents were so focused on “the kingdom” and 1975 they taught us no life skills and even allowed us to leave school, didn’t need an education.. the world is ending ! Even still, the elders thought it their duty to remind my brothers that they “needed a haircut” and “those bellbottoms” (dating myself – I know) cant where them ( I found the talk regarding Brothers wearing tight fitting pants completely hysterical, reminded me of my brothers experience) . That just skims the surface. Then , stupidly, i got married very young(after 3 whole months of seeing a brother who was recently baptized) , due to the “no dating” policy. The first night we went to the meeting as husband and wife , he was appointed a MS. All downhill from there. I got baptized at 14 yrs old and it was part of a caravan of all my friends , all being pushed into it , so our KH could shine and boast about its young. BTW, the elder who told my brother to get a haircut – two of his sons , now gay. I cannot describe the untold pressure being the wife of an elder and having children, that just want to be children. Picked on relentlessly for everything from dress to sports to service . This in part too.. because my ex wanted to be an elder cop and continually made the lives of others miserable. In the end though , knowing how the body operates(and the animosity of the brothers toward my ex, this was a golden opportunity) I would never sit before a JC and as my name suggests disassociated myself. Being out since early 2000, has been a tremendous relief and has allowed me to rebuild myself, recapture what was a lost childhood. Today, I am happy , healthy and successful in life.

      • March 5, 2015 at 1:56 am
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        “the elders thought it their duty to remind my brothers that they “needed a haircut””

        Da’, I remember the congregation overseer (before we had elders) telling me that I was starting to look like a Beatle (now you know how long ago that was) because my hair had just started to creep over my collar. I think he was jealous because he was completely bald except for a little hair on the sides and back.

        “the elder who told my brother to get a haircut – two of his sons , now gay.”

        Oh, how karma has the sweetest way of coming up from behind and biting you hard on the bum!

  • August 30, 2014 at 2:39 am
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    Rose, I think that’s the biggest reason almost every single child who is a Witness gets baptized. They just want to fit in. They have no idea what they are signing up for and the Society has to know it and they don’t care as long as it makes the numbers look good.

  • August 30, 2014 at 2:41 am
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    Sometimes it can get to personal on hear,to the point its no diffrent than the Kingdom hall …sorry to say…

  • August 30, 2014 at 9:49 am
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    Dean,

    I don’t understand your point. Would you care to elaborate, please?

    Peace be with you

    Excelsior!

  • September 2, 2014 at 12:41 pm
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    I was disfellowshipped for nearly 20 years. Because of my internal pain, including not being able to take care of my Mom, who became terminally ill; I decided to become reinstated. It took me almost a year to have that happen. Now I do not go to any meetings, but I believe I did the right thing for me and Mom. She no longer had to worry about me or any of her other children getting into trouble by the elders and others in the Organization. My family talks to me now…although a couple already had. Since then, A large weight has been taken off of me…I could not cope with never being able to speak to them freely again. My health was being affected as well. I did it for my Mom, too, and I will never regret it. The whole situation was insane and cruel.

  • September 2, 2014 at 1:15 pm
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    @Epiphany: I totally get it. For similar reasons, I remain “inactive.” It is sad, though, that the organization’s policies lead a whole lot of us to lead, for lack of a better description, “inauthentic lives.” We can never be completely open expressing ourselves and developing deep friendships. In order to maintain contact with those still active in the org, we must, for the most part, limit our conversations to the weather, pets, and holidays. Oh well, I guess it is better than nothing?

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