A 2013 District Convention talk ordering Witnesses to shun disfellowshipped relatives has been uploaded to YouTube

A talk by a Watchtower representative urging the shunning of relatives is sending shockwaves through the online JW community.

Recorded at one of the 2013 “God’s Word Is Truth” District Conventions in California, the speaker instructs Witnesses to shun family members, even children, as an act of loyalty.

In his Saturday-afternoon talk entitled “The Truth Brings ‘Not Peace, But a Sword’,” Wallkill Bethel representative Steven Bell laid the blame for the heartache of shunning squarely at the feet of those who are disfellowshipped.

“Resist self-blame,” Bell told an audience of thousands of Witnesses. “We may think that we’re at fault somehow. Remember that Jehovah holds sinners responsible for their actions. Each person has to have a personal relationship with Jehovah. Even young ones that are disfellowshipped, it’s because their relationship with Jehovah was weak.”

Since being uploaded less than 24 hours ago, the video has already received thousands of views and has provoked an angry backlash on JW forums and Facebook groups – especially among those who are currently being shunned.

Video transcript available on this link.

Ironically, even though the above talk openly encourages divisions between families on religious grounds, the official handbill circulated by Jehovah’s Witnesses to promote the convention posed the following question on its front cover…

Steven Bell

Bell’s talk, which was based on an outline provided for him by the Teaching Committee of the Governing Body, draws on Christ’s words in Matthew 10:34,35 to suggest that Witnesses should expect their beliefs to cause family divisions.

In using this scripture, the Governing Body are implying that all who are disfellowshipped from Jehovah’s Witnesses oppose God and Jesus and should therefore be shunned. Failure to shun family members who are former Witnesses is to be considered an act of disloyalty against God.

“What does Jehovah expect out of us, even if the situation is so painful that we have a family member who is disfellowshipped? What does he want?” asks Bell. “Loyalty, that’s what Jehovah wants. Jehovah knows that this is a difficult time in our life, but he wants loyalty.”

Loyalty to the Watch Tower Society is thus to be considered equal to loyalty to God.

Emotional blackmail admitted

Those who oppose Watchtower’s practice of shunning former members point to the fact that it essentially constitutes emotional blackmail. The purpose of disfellowshipping is, they say, not to restore the person’s relationship with God, but to blackmail the person into returning to the organization by holding his family hostage. Interestingly, this is precisely how disfellowshipping is presented in Bell’s talk.

Rather than being aimed at helping the individual, shunning holds a person’s family hostage until they comply with the Society’s wishes

“When someone is disfellowshipped,” explains Bell, “one of the reasons they want to come back into Jehovah’s organization is to associate with the brothers and sisters in the congregation and likely to associate with their family. So if we associate with them when they’re disfellowshipped, we could actually be taking away from them a motivating factor for wanting to be reinstated.”

Bell then attempts to drive his point home with a bizarre hypothetical scenario in which a disfellowshipped person is finally reinstated and promptly criticizes his family for not shunning him fully. Many have already commented on how unlikely this scenario would be.

“Just imagine now if we didn’t remain loyal and we talk to them [the disfellowshipped person] and associate with them,” suggests Bell. “Could you imagine the feeling we would have the night they were reinstated, and they walked up to us and said: ‘Why weren’t you loyal to Jehovah when I was disfellowshipped?’ That would cut us at our heart! But what joy you would have if they walked up and said, ‘Thank you for being loyal to Jehovah! Your example motivated me to return to serve Jehovah!’ Remember, in all cases, being loyal to Jehovah is the most important thing.”

Misrepresentation to the outside world

The recording of the shunning talk was just one of a series of audio files that were made available to JWsurvey.org. Interestingly, an announcement was read out at the start of the convention, which stated: “Any recordings of this program should be for your personal use or for the benefit of those unable to be present. Recordings should not be made available for general circulation, or distribution.”

Anyone who listens to the shunning talk will understand the Society’s concern in wanting to keep a lid on what instructions are given to Witnesses behind closed doors. Like many religious organizations, Watchtower is acutely image conscious, and wants to make sure it can control the facade it presents to the outside world – even if this involves using deception.

A 2011 clipping from the Independent

For example, in 2011 a journalist for the Independent quizzed Watchtower representative Rick Fenton on whether the Society ostracizes (or shuns) so-called apostates. Fenton replied by describing ostracization as a “personal matter for each individual to decide for himself.” Then, in early 2013, another Watchtower representative by the name of Vincent Toole described shunning as a “myth” when questioned by an Australian reporter. (click here for article)

Even the Society’s official website, JW.org, goes to considerable lengths to conceal the extent of its shunning practices. In its FAQ section under the question “Do You Shun Former Members of Your Religion?” an evasive answer is given that leaves the reader bewildered and none the wiser. The four-paragraph ‘answer’ can be summarized as follows:

  • Paragraph 1: talks about how inactive Witnesses are not shunned, even though the question specifically refers to “former members.”
  • Paragraph 2: ignores the fact that the question is about shunning entirely and discusses the judicial process, mentioning that not everyone who sins is disfellowshipped.
  • Paragraph 3: mentions that family heads are not subject to shunning – one of only two loopholes that is provided (the other being children that are too young to leave home).
  • Paragraph 4: sums up by explaining that disfellowshipped persons are invited to meetings, ignoring the fact that nobody will be allowed to speak to them, including their family members, which is shunning.

But the Society hasn’t just lied about its practice of shunning and shied away from discussing it on its official website. This new YouTube video highlights a quote from a 2009 Awake! magazine that lambasted other religions for causing family divisions, thus implying that those who choose to become Witnesses will never face this predicament.

“No one should be forced to worship in a way that he finds unacceptable or be made to choose between his beliefs and his family.” – g7/09 p.29

If only Watchtower could itself live up to the standards it expects from other faiths.

The backlash begins

Predictably, many current and former Witnesses who have seen the video have been saddened and outraged by it. Those who are themselves on the receiving end of shunning have especially expressed their dismay that this is the sort of propaganda their Witness family members are being pummelled with.

Of course, there is nothing unusual in the actual instructions conveyed in the talk. Those who are familiar with the Witness faith know about the extent to which shunning is enforced, and that it is principally intended as emotional blackmail. What makes the talk unusual is the manner in which the speaker brazenly and forcefully spells out that shunning is something Witnesses are compelled to do, even to children, in total contradiction of the image Watchtower seeks to portray to outsiders.

Now the talk is being circulated on YouTube, it is hoped that more non-JWs will be made aware of the enormous pressure Witnesses are under to inflict misery and heartache on their disfellowshipped loved ones – all in the name of “loyalty.”

It is also hoped that Steven Bell, who so passionately and enthusiastically defended the harmful policies of his Governing Body masters, does not rise any higher up the Watchtower leadership chain. If he were to ever become a Governing Body member himself, based on this talk, I shudder to think how further radicalized the organization might become in the future.

 

 

 

 

 

Further reading…

Related videos…

126 thoughts on ““Shun your disfellowshipped loved ones!”: Shocking District Convention talk hits YouTube

  • August 10, 2013 at 4:54 am
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    Mum is in shepherding call right now! I am concerned about her, this all coming on the anniversary of Dad’s passing. Anyone have any advice on how I should proceed?

    On the wider topic, no one ever looks at how Jesus handled talking with people!!

    Off hand he spoke with:

    Satan, Judas Iscariot, a Samaritan woman, Pontius Pilate, sinners, prostitutes, tax collectors etc

    In short, Jesus spoke with everyone! There was no one he wouldn’t talk to!

    Surely, as Christians, Jehovah’s Witnesses should follow his example above all others and talk to everyone too.

    • August 10, 2013 at 8:41 am
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      Hello George, I’m sorry you’re going through this. It sounds like you handled the situation perfectly by giving the woman the choice to clean the home with you in it or return another day. Neither you or your Mum can hardly be blamed for any perceived “contact” that followed.

      Sadly, there is no rhyme or reason to the way many elders think and act. Some are liberal and avoid getting involved in petty problems, whereas others relish the same as opportunities to impose their authority. Once an authoritarian elder has a bee in his bonnet about something, there can be no stopping him. If I were in your shoes, I would just roll with it.

      Perhaps when things quieten down you can remind your mother of what happened and how poorly the situation was handled – particularly coming on the anniversary of your father’s death.

      Cedars

  • August 10, 2013 at 3:50 pm
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    Thank you very much for your good advice. The elders were very kind to mum, apparently, for which I am pleased. They simply reiterated that she is not to discuss “spiritual” things with me.

    It is strange to be affected by them after all the time and life experiences I have had. Luckily for me, my Mum is the only one in my family that is a JW. I have genuine pity for those poor souls whose entire family are JWs.

    I really appreciate your even handed approach to the whole problem of unaccountable power married with a lack of true understanding. I will continue to rely upon your decency and moral standing to alert me to their latest machinations. With respect and gratitude, george

  • August 10, 2013 at 4:07 pm
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    I’d like to note that the uncomfortable part from the young “sister” may be due to Victorian etiquette that a single sister would not be alone in the presence of a man–single or married, even with your mother present, if the young lady felt so inclined. However, if she’s stating her discomfort coming to the house with a d/f Witness interaction that’s regrettable. I would also suggest that since you’re doing well in life, you come to your mother’s rescue by scheduling a cleaning service–paid, or other provisions that local charities and government services provide.

    One additional note, you mention you abide by the GB’s rule not to talk with Witnesses. Why? If you don’t care about the GB or what their opinion of you, why follow their silly rules regarding shunning? Bear hug them, and walk away, chuckling, when they are aghast and scrambling to run.

  • August 12, 2013 at 5:27 am
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    That is a fair question. Although I do not care about the GB or the rest, my mother does. I have to bear in mind that if I go round bear hugging JWs, then it’s pretty likely that my mum will be hauled over the coals, or at least be viewed negatively. My mum could not survive without the witnesses. She needs them in her life.

    Also, I have no desire to cause others distress. If I were to get in the faces of Witnesses, then I would be accomplishing nothing but reenforcing their negative attitudes. They would not benefit from it.

    My stance is right for me. It keeps the witnesses off my mum’s back, and allows the witnesses to hopefully see that an ex witness is not a diner with demons, but an ordinary person.

  • August 27, 2013 at 6:11 am
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    Hello folks, I have just finished looking at the shepherding the flock of god book. It says clearly that staying in touch with disfellowshipped family members will NOT result in disciplinary action if you don’t

    1. Discuss spiritual things with them
    2. Openly criticise the disfellowshipping.

    Of course, your standing in the congregation will be affected.

    So there is scope to talk to relatives. Only trouble is, the non elders can’t read this book!

    They are trying to cover themselves from any litigation etc.

    • August 28, 2013 at 8:12 am
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      George,
      I wanted to acknowledge the respect and consideration that you are giving your mother and her well-being. You are treating her with kindness and your gentle spirit are pleasing to our King. It sounds like you are handling things well, and it is good to know that you can maintain a relationship with your mother. You are to be commended for respecting her beliefs and recognizing her need for the JW’s in her life. I’m in a similar situation with one of my sisters. However, I am also being called to rescue my parents, who know better.
      Keep your mild and humble attitude. Being rude to JW’s, mocking them or purposely confronting them just to cause discomfort, would only prove their teachings to be true. By acting like a decent and forgiving human being, you are proving them wrong! Good work. Thanks for the example!
      (From an ordinary, run of the mill apostate, never baptized, but still being shunned by my sister, who is controlled by fear and confusion)

  • August 27, 2013 at 6:20 am
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    The relevant page is 116.

    I’m not defending the WTBTS. I know that the elders will come round and really emotionally blackmail anyone who does keep contact.

    If you re a brother and want to promoted, forget it! You won’t be in good standing. But they can’t disfellowship you!

    I hope this may be of some use and comfort to those facing, as I do, the fact that they are disfellowshipped and have family in the witnesses still.

    Cedars, any chance that you could quote the passage as part of your article?

  • August 28, 2013 at 11:45 am
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    Thanks, faithful witness. I don’t think that the witnesses should be shunning you if you weren’t baptised! Cedars, am I right that only baptised people are shunned by family?

    You have my sincere sympathy, faithful witness. I really hope that the work of Cedars and others may bring some positive changes. All the best.

    • August 28, 2013 at 11:48 am
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      “Cedars, am I right that only baptised people are shunned by family?”

      Officially, that’s correct. However, as we all know, anyone can be labelled “bad association” and shunned whether baptized or not.

  • August 28, 2013 at 12:37 pm
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    Cedars August 28, 2013 at 11:48 am

    “Cedars, am I right that only baptised people are shunned by family?”

    “Officially, that’s correct. However, as we all know, anyone can be labelled “bad association” and shunned whether baptized or not”

    I believe you mean “Marking” which is a long standing policy of slander that I never really understood as being official or unofficial but is very real!

    As is slander itself whether slander per se, by simply saying “This person is a no good such and such!” Also from the platform in the form of repeated “local needs” or focused warnings etc. Sometimes rather elaborate schemes, violence and the police are involved as a rouse.
    Active slander, by involving themselves in the lives and affairs in such a way that it works out that so and so gets arrested and his name appears in the paper, his wife leaves him and just happens…to file a restraining order and the Elders are “forced” to convene” a judicial committee.
    Applied slander, No one will sit with this person or talk to them. If anyone does “by accident?” The will overtly get up in view of everyone in a public scene and move to demonstrate the ostracism.
    Tacit slander, The Elders and Servants as well as the Congregation at large may all possibly participate knowingly or unwittingly in the above forms of slander regularly and approve of it or any of the many perfected means that the congregations have established over the years….

    • August 28, 2013 at 12:44 pm
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      Hi Konrad – no I don’t just mean marking. The question was to do with whether non-baptized people can be shunned. Obviously unbaptized members of a congregation are susceptible to neither shunning nor marking, but they can still be classed as “bad association” and given the same treatment.

  • August 28, 2013 at 1:08 pm
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    That’s absolutely true and for many years unbaptized people could even suffer the same consequences of disassociation until the late 80’s or early 90’s I believe when the Society changed the policy…simply for choosing to study but not commit!

    • August 29, 2013 at 10:31 am
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      That was us… Students who never committed. Our bible teacher would actually threaten my husband when they were alone. “Do you want to sentence your entire family to be cut off at Armageddon, or are you going to start making some progress here?”

  • August 29, 2013 at 6:10 am
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    Thanks, Cedars. Ah, the catch all of “bad associations”. The context shows that it’s people in the congregation, but it is widened or shrunk to fit whichever group they detest and fear.

    As I’ve mentioned in a previous post, the new feature film The Prodigal Returns, states in the interview section that anyone who doesn’t follow bible principles is a bad association. They should really be shunning EVERYONE who isn’t a witness!

    That would make the preaching work problematic! So it’s ok to be charming and appear concerned to convert others, but woe betide them if they don’t agree or even worse fall away!

    The passage in the shepherding book can’t be seen by ordinary publishers. They don’t know that they can get away with contact. However, from what Cedars is saying, they may not be able to disfellowship you, but they can mark you and shun you anyway.

    I remember studying the Salem Witch Trials as part of my degree. When the accusations began to fly, there was one case I remember.

    A Rich man’s daughter was accused. The father immediately threatened to sue in the secular courts. The charges were dropped.

    Maybe it’s time to start suing the WTBTS for mental cruelty from the shunning their ex members receive! Surely there must be some legal redress?

    • August 29, 2013 at 10:29 am
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      My husband and I were called “open-hearted ones,” when we were studying with the JW’s. When we asked too many questions, and directed our questions at the society itself, that label changed. Suddenly, we were “too educated and full of ourselves to submit” to Jehovah’s (read “The Watchtower’s”) commands. They don’t like independent thinkers.

      My brother in law accused us of “turning our backs on Jehovah (again, “Watchtower”), and decided that the correct course of action, was to avoid us. My sister called me and told me she had to protect her children from me, and had a hard time explaining our apostasy and idolatry.

      My story is mild, compared to many. I need to write my own blog. Haha. Anyway, it just got worse. Last night, I discovered that my mom is also likely baptized. This is a sad realization for me, since I was thinking there might be hope for her. No true, unconditional love comes from a true Jehovah’s Witness. Sadly, these are the only living grandparents we have for my kids.

      I’m so grateful for God’s direction in my life. I was led back to the REAL TRUTH, because of the questions raised by the JW’s.

      Thank you, Cedars, for standing on guard and informing us all of the Watchtower happenings. I am following your site with great interest, and have quoted you in conversations with my parents.

      • August 29, 2013 at 10:41 am
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        I wanted to add, since I’m sure there might be some here, who are going through a lot more pain and anguish than I am over this issue… I have forgiven them. They don’t know better.

        I know it might sound condescending, but my brother in law is really just trying to do the right thing. He has earned a new pin on his spiritual lapel, having chosen “Jehovah’s organization” over an apostate family member. I get it. I was bitter for a long time, but I have been washed with a new compassion for him and his situation.

        I believe that God is directing this, and he does want me to lead them out of this abusive and controlling religion… But it will not be in my timing. I need reminders to be humble and patient. I don’t have to be right, or win any debates. The evidence and the truth are available to all who seek it. Thank you, God, for showing us the light, before we jumped into the pool.

        The July 15 magazine, is going to be the first major prophecy shift that my family has to accommodate. I’m hoping that their eyes will be opened. You can’t build a solid foundation (or tower) on shifting sands. Where in the bible, is there evidence of prophecies that shift? Have any of the WTS predictions come true? Anyone?

      • August 29, 2013 at 4:47 pm
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        FW, your tale of distress is typical; no one can come into direct contact with Witnesses and leave untouched or wounded. You will either assimilate or be annihilated is the world view, thus if choose not to continue with JW’s there’s a label for you depending on their grading sluices for you–unable to grasp the fine truths of the Watchtower, blinded by Satan, sheep, opposed to Jehovah / Watchtower. It has to be done THE WAY of the Watchtower and no deviation, or it is Satanic. Black. White. There is no gray. Those who are not with us are against us.

    • August 29, 2013 at 4:29 pm
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      Based on observations over the years.

      The deal with shunning or disciplining of unbaptized individuals is the degree of involvement and recognition by the “outsiders” that a person was/is JW. Persons who studied, maybe attended meetings, etc would still be regarded as candidates for future visits but not invited regularly to social gatherings if they ceased to study because they fall into “worldly association” category. If a person went into field service/ministry work, that person would garner an announcement that they were no longer considered as associated with Witnesses and in some cases shunned if they denounced the doctrines of Witnesses [say, dropped JW’s after reading something on the Internet or decided that their libertine lifestyle was more “fun” than being a staid and frumpy Witness].

      If the individual decides after observing the ministry, etc, they fall into the weak category and remain eligible for occasional visits to achieve stimulation into activity/action unless it was inability to cease “conduct unbecoming” behaviors then that person goes to “marked” and association and visits cease. Lighting up a doobie during your last Bible Study with Witnesses, as an example. Or, propping your feet up on your New Age Occult altar.

      Children of Witnesses were a different matter and therein lies the reference to the compulsory service video Cedars posted awhile back. At some point, the “older men” of the congregation may decide a certain unbaptized child is no longer fit association and depending on the severity of the “sins” publicly denounce or privately discipline for marking. If the kid was duped into baptism, it can be any of the various forms of discipline from private restrictions to public humiliation and “scarlet letter” shame. The point of all this from congregational and pastoral perspective is “keeping the organization clean” [nevermind the pedophiles], but from a secular view, it’s about control, domination and influence over minds through intimidation.

      From child’s perspective, it was always better to string along the congregation until maturity age and one could finally move out and away without “taking a stand” and thus becoming ostracized for not meeting the lofty standards and ideal Witness behaviors expected. Thus, the diatribe from GB to compel parents to force their kids into ministry and ultimately baptism.

      Also, JW meeting places can not be categorized as a “welcoming congregation” from the LGBT perspective or any other because the primary purpose of meetings is recruiting and maintaining the indoctrination of those recruited/converted. Yes, there is the greeting of visitors with smiles and handshakes but all for singular goal of recruiting.

  • August 30, 2013 at 9:10 am
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    Yes, JBob, they are salesmen, with sales men’s smiles. Kind when it suits them, cruel the rest of the time.

    Cedars, have any group commissioned a psychological assessment of shunning? There should be some research on this somewhere. Maybe it’s something the AAWA, or whatever their title is could pay for one? Nothing thumps a lie better than accredited, verifiable data!!

    There is a famous experiment where blue eyed and brown eyed people are separated and given ruler and ruled status. It doesn’t take too long for the horror to begin.

    Keep up the good fight!

  • September 8, 2013 at 3:56 pm
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    Sad but truth ! I am dfw. right now and trying to get back into the organization but mainly to get my family and particularly my kids back. I do love Jehovah but I am tired of all of this crap and tirant elders ! I used to be an elder and bethelite, so I do know a lot more than the regular members.

    • September 8, 2013 at 4:10 pm
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      It is sickening that they are using your family to blackmail you back into the organization. Knowing what you know about them, I’m curious why you would go back. Would it please Jehovah, if you serve them again?

      Do Jehovah’s Witnesses have the one true religion? What can you share with us to convince us? I was unable to reach that conclusion.

      • September 8, 2013 at 5:50 pm
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        Speaking of Jehovah, the one true Midianite god, I saw a recent historical documentary on the validity and factual nature of the first series of biblical texts and by extension the factual nature of early Christian viewpoints on whom Jesus would be. It seems the early Christian history is not as “pure” as the Watchtower and other denominations would have us believe. Gospels that were ordered destroyed, yet secretly stashed in caves, tell the tale of a diverse Christian community. It gives the Watchtower an “out” in inventing its ideology and theology, but skewers when it comes to the claim of a single path to God.

        On a sidebar note, years prior to the Millerite movement that eventually gave us the wart–Watchtower–a group known as The Harmony Society arrived from Germany (chased out by Lutherans) under the leading intellect of George Rapp. Their belief was that the mass of wars in early 1800’s was a prelude to the end of the world–expected in their lifetimes and before 1844. George Rapp died just a little after 1844, in 1847 if memory serves. The Harmony Society settled into western and middle Pennsylvania creating astounding business and economic success and driving establishment of various railroads to service these industries. Like the counterpart Mormon religion in Upstate New York, the Harmony Society began to migrate westward into The Indiana Territory before reaching its demise (mainly due to its view of celibacy as a virtue and curious difficulty recruiting adherents).

  • September 8, 2013 at 11:10 pm
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    Better yet, at the convention I attended, it was announced that an audio recording would be made available to each congregation. Perhaps the wife could request to borrow her local congregation’s copy, to hear for herself?

    • September 8, 2013 at 11:14 pm
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      My comment was intended as a reply to Zeebo… Apparently the iPad browser is not processing the “reply” link properly…

  • September 22, 2013 at 7:47 pm
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    Es triste, pero una muy penosa realidad en la organizacion y cruel forma de disciplina que estoy seguro Jehova no aprueba, sobre todo en los que se arrepienten de corazon y aun asi tienen que esperar minimo un ano o mas dependiendo de los ancianos…….porque ese es otro obstaculo para regresar, los ancianos ! Pero si fuistes “amigo” de ellos puedes regresar en solo unos meses…..que ironia !

  • October 5, 2013 at 10:21 am
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    We need another Raymond Franz!

  • October 6, 2013 at 1:28 pm
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    I am currently going through a living hell right now. I was born and raised witness, every single person in my family except 1 uncle was apart of the church. My 2 sisters and my mother has left. I left the church and was disfellowshipped am now shunned. I left my abusive and cheating husband we have a now 16 year old daughter and he has a 20 year old son who I adopted. I have had my children taken away from me by my family and haven’t been allowed to see them in over 4 years, no photos, no letters, nothing. I lost my entire family. I was told that if I wanted to see my kids and family again I had to come back to the church. After being in the church for 29 years I now see how much of a cult like feel they actually have.

    • October 7, 2013 at 1:14 am
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      I’m sorry to hear you’re going through such pain Rachel. Please know that there are many in situations similar to yours. I would strongly recommend that you send an email to support@aawa.co – there you should find some comfort and advice.

  • October 11, 2013 at 11:46 am
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    I just came home from work and someone stopped by and put a folded up Watchtower, out of date as well, in my door with a paragraph marked discussing how parents decisions affect their children. This is harassment and unreal. Leave me alone you already have my children what more do they want.

  • November 8, 2013 at 7:33 pm
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    Much respect to all who visit here and in particular to Cedars. I have never been a JW. However I have done the studies to the point of decision. Luckily for me, at that time I was about to get married to my childhood sweetheart and I was told to instead find a man in the “Truth”
    I was bewildered as they had never met my future Partner, how could they write him off and devalue him so crudely?
    Maybe he would have made a great Witness, even become an Elder. Anyway, It caused me to do some research before I made the “leap of faith” and I was “saved”. Most of my family are JW’s including my older and younger Brothers and they baptized my Son and now my Grand Kids.
    Luckily, I have learned to be careful what I say so as not to awaken the beast. I have no plan to encourage them to leave the “Truth” but I need to be around to give them the critical loving support if they are ever thrown out of this speeding vehicle. Time is longer than rope as the 144,000 are no more yet I am still here.
    It occurred to me as I watched and learned much from exJW’s on Youtube etc; I have been impressed by how patient, loving, even handed, truthful and decent most of them are (particularly in this Blog), could it be that becoming an apostate is finally achieving the “Truth” and being a JW is only a part of the journey? I would be honoured to be regarded as your Sister. Thank you all for the depth of your compassion and humanity.

  • November 13, 2013 at 5:20 pm
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    Many jehovah witnesses develop ptsd and particulary post traumatic embiterment dissorder why because they have had there identity stripped away.
    They all suffer totalitarian abuse
    So many feel hopeless and have low self esteem particulary as they where not allowed to mix with non believers and mainly had little education so mental illness is fourfold to general population when are they going to take resposibility could I take out a lawsuit for emotional abuse……

  • December 11, 2013 at 8:44 pm
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    excellent article typical watchtower rhetoric i know i left the jws in 1993 my family wil not speak to me with the exception of my one brother but i am happy to be out of that rotten organization

  • December 27, 2013 at 5:02 am
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    I have posted my messages a number of times to let the truth about JW child cruelty from the 1950’s and beyond be told by one who suffered. I cannot express the damage my family, 2 brothers and I, suffered emotionally and mentally from our mother’s Watchtower brainwashing and total mind control. I wish I had the words to express the damage. When mind control and FEAR tactics (demons everywhere and Armageddon destruction) is present then there is no “freedom.” Nor, is there this “big happy loving family of “brothers and sisters” if the Watchtower rules their entirelife like it did when I was a young child.

  • February 4, 2014 at 9:17 pm
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    I could not refrain from commenting. Perfectly written!

  • March 6, 2014 at 1:07 pm
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    I agree – I have family members who have returned to the Organization ONLY because they want to associate with the family NOT because they love Jehovah or the Watchtower; forcing them to live a double life. Why would a religious organization Force people to act hypocritically. I think they are more interested in the watchtower numbers than the real interest or spirituality of the person. (p.s. I have become inactive and slowly fading..)

  • March 6, 2014 at 1:27 pm
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    I was disfellowshipped in 2002, over a personal problem called depression and accused of not put our hevenly father (Jehovah) first and had to appear before a judicial commite of four elders who were quite aware of my mental health problems, and they off-quoted sciptures to me saying I haven’t trusted God enough, I left that Kingdom Hall that evening feeling really numb and confused and frightened. That talk I have just heard Steven Bell ranting over has made me somewhat annoyed with the WT&BTS.I am now glad I’m no longer with a bunch of false prophets who claim to know what Christian love is all about !!!

  • March 29, 2014 at 2:45 am
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    Similarly here in the United Kingdom disfellowshipping or the act of shunning or to cause harassment or distress to a person based on religious or non-religious grounds is against the law.

    There are ways for us to take action although I’m of the firm belief that rather than do this individually, we should all get together en masse and submit a massive complaint to the police and the government on a set date, at a set time, and let the media know of our collective action prior to the event taking place for more exposure.

    Further information about this is available on the following links which you might want to copy and paste into a new tab:

    Report Hate Crime:
    https://www.gov.uk/report-hate-crime

    Discrimination: Your rights & types of discrimination: https://www.gov.uk/discrimination-your-rights

    How you be discriminated against: https://www.gov.uk/discrimination-your-rights/how-you-can-be-discriminated-against

    What you can do:
    https://www.gov.uk/discrimination-your-rights/what-you-can-do

    You can report hate crime here:
    http://report-it.org.uk/your_police_force

    Internet Hate Crime: Offensive Material and the Law:
    http://www.report-it.org.uk/reporting_internet_hate_crime

    Incidentally, if you find any material on JW.org which you find offensive as a disfellowshipped or disassociated individual and you are currently being shunned completely you might want to contact Amazon.com who host JW.org on their servers.

    It is very highly likely that Amazon.com have their own rules about hate speech and discrimination online in their terms of service, so if you find an article or a quote at JW.org particularly offensive to you as an individual, do ensure you complain to Amazon directly as they have the power, if enough complaints are received, to take the official JW.org website offline rendering it temporarily disabled. (Which again could create some great media coverage to highlight the very sad situation many of us find ourselves in, being bullied as we are by the JW’s and the WTBTS for years on end).

    Organisations that can help here in the UK if you feel discriminated against on religious grounds:
    http://www.report-it.org.uk/organisations_that_can_help

    Racist or Religious Hate Crime: What is racist or religious hate crime?:
    http://www.report-it.org.uk/racist_or_religious_hate_crime1

    “Hate crimes and incidents are any crime or incident which is targeted at a victim because of the offender’s hostility or prejudice against an identifiable group of people.

    So any incident or crime which is perceived to be motivated because of a person’s race, ethnicity or religion – either their actual ethnicity/religion or ethnicity/religion as perceived by the offender – will be recorded as such. Hate crimes can be committed against a person or property.

    A racist or religious hate crime is: Any criminal offence which is perceived, by the victim or any other person, to be motivated by a hostility or prejudice based on a person’s religion or perceived religion.”

    How can I report an incident?

    Details on how to report an incident and what you can report is available on the ‘Report a hate crime’ page. You can use a self reporting form or complete the online form on the ‘Reporting online’ page. You may also be able to report incidents through the organisations listed on this website on the ‘Organisations that can help’ page.

    By reporting it, you may be able to prevent these incidents from happening to someone else.

    Reporting makes a difference…to you, your friends, your community and your life.
    How will the Police and CPS treat Racist and Religious Hate Crime?

    The Police and other criminal justice agencies consider all hate crime to be very serious, including racist and religious hate crime. When a case is prosecuted, the courts can impose a stronger sentence under powers from the Criminal Justice Act 2003. This reflects the priority placed on these crimes. The Police have performance targets and measures in place to ensure the service they offer is of the highest standard.

    The Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) is the organisation that takes cases through the court system. They have produced guidance on Racist and Religious Hate Crime that is available on the ‘Prosecuting hate crimes’ page of this website (opens in new window). – http://www.report-it.org.uk/racist_or_religious_hate_crime1

  • May 22, 2014 at 8:20 am
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    A few days ago, as I drove past a neighbor she smiled and waved. As a normal, neighborly gesture I returned the simple wave. I was immediately chastised for doing so because, “You can’t do that! She is disfellowshipped!”
    When I was DF’d years ago a “special” talk was given admonishing the congregation that it was improper to even make eye contact at an intersection with “a disfellowshipped person.” Another case a fellow had suffered a severe head injury after being DF’d. After a late night meeting I saw him struggling to walk several miles home, in a driving thunderstorm. When I offered him a safe ride home he refused because, “The elders might see and then both of us will never get back in, because we associated.” It was only a flipping ride I offered. This kind of unkind, judgmental attitude is fostered by the leadership of the organization. And that leadership doesn’t seem to be Jesus.

  • June 14, 2014 at 10:56 am
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    seems like every few years they crack down on shunning. since the 70’s i remember how my mom would flip flop in relation to my siblings who left the organzation. one year she would talk to them and the next it was taboo again, another couple years and it was ok again. hurts my head thinking about it.

  • July 10, 2014 at 7:42 am
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    My now husband and I have been df and it is so funny when they say come to the elders with issues your are having and they will help you so when we went to them they decided that they were going to df us any ways only because I the woman would not disclose to these perverts how and what was done in the bedroom when we did the deed. I mean they asked him di you (CUM) did we have Oral sex and was I on top of Him of not I mean ?WHY do they need to know this they keeo pn saying the viewing porn is a NO NO but wanting to know the details of our encounter is that still not a mental porn image when they go home and remember the details given? Well in short it has not been 4 plus years and they also state that since me the woman is not being humble with the questions asked it might take 20 years before a re-instatement be granted to us so we are coping and we are happy in out marriage and we know that God is not the organization and that he loves you because we have repented of our sin and we know he has forgiven us. Have a blessed day.

  • July 10, 2014 at 2:43 pm
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    And they contradict themselves because if not shunning someone meant they had no reason to come back, then the hypothetical returnee wouldn’t have returned to ask why he hadn’t been shunned. According to Watchtower reasoning, faithfully shunning (psychologically abusing) a family member is the key to their return to meetings, so Bell’s scenario falls flat.

    Great emphasis is placed on loyalty to Jehovah and it is obvious this is a smokescreen for loyalty to Society teachings.

    The power-hungry, deluded Governing Body seems to forget that believing in Jesus was the key to salvation, not attending modern-day Dub meetings.

    For those who leave and who still believe in Christ, the scriptures tell of a very different outcome.

    Jesus did not shun sinners but the harsh religious leaders did.

    • July 11, 2014 at 6:46 am
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      After years of “studying” with the wonderful friends we met at the Kingdom Hall, my husband and I came to the conclusion that we would never become members of the Organization. We decided to stop lying to them, and we stopped our study, and no longer attended meetings.

      My sister came to the opposite conclusion about the “Truth,” and is now a devout JW.

      I was cornered (alone, without my husband!) by my brother in law. He accused me of “turning my back on Jehovah.” They have stopped all communication from our family, labelled us as “apostates” and “idolators,” because we decided to go to church and follow the teachings of Jesus Christ, over those of the Watchtower.

      I have come to realize that when a JW uses the (blasphemous) term, “Jehovah,” he is not really referring to God the Father. Anytime the word “Jehovah” is muttered or spoken in the presence of a JW, his mind has been trained to think “Jehovah’s Organization.” They do not worship God, nor do they follow the teachings of Christ.

      I am ashamed and sickened that I actually believed what they told me about Jesus.

  • August 16, 2014 at 7:10 am
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    I have four (4) adult children and its obvious to me that even in view of the venom spewed by the gb (no caps for them) regarding associating with d/f or d/a, 3 have still chosen to show respect to me as their mother. That, and only that, would be the inspiration for any return.

  • August 20, 2014 at 2:09 am
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    Hi George – where did you find the shepherding the flock of god book? I would love to show it to a family member who is shunning other family members. It’s causing so much hurt and heartache and would be wonderful to continue to respect each others beliefs and have a loving relationship again. We just want everyone to be talking to each other again. The two are sisters and elderly and its affecting their health. They love each other very much.

  • September 25, 2014 at 3:24 pm
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    I believe it ironic that if I were to break the rules of commenting here, which I am not intending, I would be “disfellowshipped” from this message board. Why? Obviously to maintain order over unruliness. We are all governed by rules and our Creator has lovingly provided us warnings to keep us from serious harm. I do not keep company with offensive people. I ask Jehovah to help them the same way He helped me. By maintaining my life as I slowly sank to my own rebellious bottom.
    Anyway, long story short: I no longer do the things I used to do because I live by a growing sense of moral obligation to myself and my fellowman. I learn these morals everyday. If someone associated with me back then, it was because they were as sick as I was.
    Having said that, I rarely attend meetings although I was reinstated the July before last. I am scared my son will not be accepted because of who I am: a twice-convicted felon. Jehovah helps me along in leaps and bounds, but I will always possess certain traits that make me seemingly strange to others. I believe very strongly in evangelizing, so I won’t expect not to be “disfellowshipped” by the “gb” of this board. I simply have the desire and fortitude to shares my experience in the hopes it may assist those who are weak. In other words, “don’t look at me, look at the judge!”
    I most sincerely apologize to those who take offense. I plan on developing my self-honesty, not my self-righteousness. This is an exercise in the expression of my heart among those whom I believe to be capable of offering judgement for the sole purpose of interpersonal growth in Christ. Confess your sins openly to one another type thing.
    Fear is not a part of healthy expressions of worship to our Father amongst our fellow Christians. Fear belongs to God. Not you or any other mothers’ sons.
    Again, I apologize for the expected reception of this sublimation. But at this finite point in my life, I believe strongly in honest expressions over rigid and self-righteous rhetoric. Just now my eyes have received the gift of a beautiful fire rainbow over the western horizon. Such beauty is only possible by the loving provisions of the One who will one day soon receive my last breath as He gave it.

    • September 25, 2014 at 10:26 pm
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      Anybody who thinks being blocked from commenting on a website is equivalent to being arbitrarily cut off from his family and long-time friends, potentially for the rest of his life, is either delusional or doesn’t understand what shunning is, or how psychologically devastating it can be. Whatever point you’re trying to make, I and others who are ACTUALLY being shunned by our loved ones at the whim of the Governing Body would appreciate if you could express it in a less obscene and insensitive manner.

  • September 26, 2014 at 3:06 am
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    Well, I see some similarities shared by shunning and what worldly people do. But the shunning of the loyal Jehovah’s Witnesses does not beat a person to death metaphorically speaking. They just leave you alone. The kind of anti-social behavior of ex-jehovah’s witnesses makes you feel like a lesser person than they are. And what is weird about it is they ALL seem to do it. I think your post was well thought out and from the heart. I appreciate it and you. Never expect any appreciation from former “believers”. It doesn’t exist.

    • September 26, 2014 at 3:10 am
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      Is this a serious comment, or have I misread it in some way? Did you really suggest that shunning by JW loved ones isn’t devastating, they “just leave you alone?” What if I don’t want to be “left alone” by my father, sister, uncle, other extended family members simply because I no longer share their religious views?

  • September 26, 2014 at 3:48 am
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    No. I didn’t say that. I said your kind of unfriendliness feels just as bad as shunning to some people. That is what the man said above and I think you received it very poorly. You do. You know?

    • September 26, 2014 at 3:54 am
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      If you didn’t say that, then what precisely did you mean by “they just leave you alone?” Who precisely is “they?”

      As to “unfriendliness” I have news for you that you may not like. I am no longer in a cult that demands that I have compulsory love for everyone I encounter. I am now free to chose who my friends are. I certainly don’t need to embrace people who are stupid and narrow-minded enough to believe that being blocked from interacting with complete strangers on some random website is tantamount to having your family decimated by Watchtower’s immoral, unbiblical and abhorrent shunning policy.

  • September 26, 2014 at 4:04 am
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    They leave you alone means loyal Jehovah’s Witnesses let you be. I don’t have generations of family members who are Jehovah’s Witnesses are so I can’t know the pain. I DO know the pain of being hated by former Jehovah’s Witnesses which is what the post was about. His post was not about what THEY do. It was about what YOU do. Am I wrong?

    • September 26, 2014 at 4:24 am
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      So I was right. If “they” are indeed loyal Witnesses, then “they just leave you alone” is an outrageously offensive and insensitive statement for those of us who are being shunned by loyal JW family members. As I mentioned before, I don’t WANT them to “leave me alone” or “let me be.” I want them in my life, irrespective of what they believe. And yes, I would prefer confrontation to silence, an opportunity to exchange views (however blunt or “unfriendly”) to total ostracism. Shunning is a COMPLETELY different matter to being blocked from a random website for ignoring its posting guidelines. That fact that you can’t see that indicates that you are either deluded or incapable of putting yourself in the shoes of others, or perhaps both.

      • September 28, 2014 at 4:38 pm
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        Well I shouldn’t even try to explain because I see that no one is listening. Shunning means “I want nothing to do with you”. Jehovah’s Witnesses think like that because they BELIEVE God demands it. God. You know? Cedars even says it (I want nothing to so with you who are Jehovah Witness sympathisers) in his own words like most ex JWs on the internet do. Do they not do that? But he goes the extra yard and insults them at every opportunity. OK? Most just IGNORE us. He adds insults. I know what disfellowshipping means. I don’t know how it feels. The bad feelings it causes in some people seems to cause meanness. I have not met a kind ex JWs yet. Have you?

    • September 26, 2014 at 7:27 am
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      Nancy: I can see what you are saying, and agree that sometimes Cedars’ replies do come across as bitter and condescending. Perhaps you can try to have a little more compassion for his and others’ situations.

      He is a new father, and he is separated from his entire family. He does not want to be left alone. He has done nothing to deserve this treatment from his family that he loves, yet he forgives them.

      I don’t know if you are a JW, or just an interested person who visits this website.

      I’m confused about why you are attacking this website and its guidelines for posting. Being welcomed to comment on jwsurvey, is not the same as being welcomed into the home of a family member that you truly love.

      I have never been a JW, but since I studied the religion and chose not to join, my sister has now cut me off from her family. My kids have been cut off from their cousins that they love (young children who did NOT choose to become JW’s, but are forced to go to meetings). Our family has been ripped apart by the controlling policies of the Watchtower Organization.

      Our family chose to follow Jesus and what the Bible REALLY does teach: Love and forgiveness. Other members of our family have chosen to serve an organization and make a stand against us.

      I do NOT shun my sister. The gifts and cards I send, get returned. I have been instructed NOT to send gifts to her children, at any time (even when I ordered online and had it directly shipped to them).

      I can choose if I want to visit this website or any other. If I want to post comments, it makes sense that they would be monitored by the administrator. Comments are allowed and encouraged here. I think the guidelines are reasonable and fair (I myself have been corrected by Cedars in the past).

      I appreciate your comments. I am glad that this and other websites exist, so that JW’s, and those who have been affected by them and the Watchtower, can have a place to express their concerns and thoughts.

      Are comments allowed by the Watchtower?
      If a sincere JW has a concern about something the Watchtower says or does, where can he voice his opinion?

  • September 26, 2014 at 5:29 am
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    Nancy, are you saying it’s the “former Jehovah’s Witnesses” who are shunning the “loyal Jehovah’s Witnesses?” That makes absolutely no sense to me and I have been one of these JW’s for almost 50 years. Are you familiar with the disfellowshipping policy at all?????

  • September 28, 2014 at 4:42 pm
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    I am sorry I posted this to the last comment. Disgareeing is not allowed in or out of the JW organization. It’s a bad dream for sure.

  • September 28, 2014 at 4:50 pm
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    It is not called shunning what the ex-Jehovah’s Witnesses do and they don’t do it to loyal JWs. They do it to other ex-JWs who do not take their side. And I suspect it feels a lot like shunning feels like. We were brothers and sisters. Now we are hated. It doesn’t feel good.

  • February 12, 2015 at 1:14 pm
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    The only other religious sect that practices this extreme form of shunning are the Amish, and it’s well documented and recognised. People in general are so ignorant to how as to how insidious and nasty this cult is.
    The jehovahs witnesses are viewed as slightly nice but weird people who knock on your door trying to peddle magazines and religion. I could write a book on the nastiness and evil I’ve suffered at the hands of this so called religion. I’m not bitter I’ve moved on and built a happy and successful life for myself and my children. My so called mother has not seen her grandchildren since they were babies, my son is disabled and I could really do with some help and support.
    I have offered contact on numerous occasions where she does not have to interact with me in any shape or form.
    She is in her second marriage to an elder/delivery man and seems more eager to please him and her so called god. To call themselves christian is a complete joke my mum’s,running round pioneering trying to save the world while her disabled grandson has literally one person to look out for him. If you are thinking of joining the jehovahs witnesses and haven’t been born into it aka brainwashed seek counselling as it will fit a gap in your life or psyche that is missing.

  • February 12, 2015 at 1:55 pm
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    I feel so sad for your situation kez, I can only imagine how heartbreaking this is for you. I can tell that you aren’t feeling sorry for you but for your son & the lack of love that he deserves from his grandparents. He is just an innocent victim in this selfish cult.

    The observation that I noticed all of the years I have been with witnesses is that anyone who was in the ‘too hard basket’ was just left to fend for themselves. The ones that did try to help those ones were left to do it on their own, hence burn out. I know from experience.

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