Watchtower’s much-anticipated 129th Annual Meeting was held today at the Stanley Theater, New Jersey. In an unprecedented move, the event was streamed live to 1,830 locations – a global audience of nearly 1.5 million Jehovah’s Witnesses.
Sadly I was among those without an invitation. The Governing Body does not tend to welcome with open arms those like me who are critical of some of their teachings and policies.
But thankfully I have not been left entirely in the dark, and neither has anyone else for that matter! One brave blogger going by the name of “DrJohnChrist” who attended one of the streaming locations has provided a running commentary via a thread on the Reddit social network.
Much of the hype leading up to the Annual Meeting surrounded the fact that there has been a far-reaching shortage of New World Translations over the last few months, with congregation stocks running dry. This led to rumors that a new version of the English New World Translation was in preparation – and it seems these whispers were not wide of the mark.
It fell to Governing Body member Geoffrey Jackson to announce the new release. Revised into 21st Century English with a grey cover and silver edges, a revision of the New World Translation bible has been released today with the PDF version available on Monday 7th (presumably on JW.org). This is what it looks like…
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Nicknamed the “witnessing bible” (according to Stephen Lett), a large-print version will be available in 2014 followed by a pocket version. A large bible with wide margins for note-taking is also planned. The new bibles feature a “mini reasoning book,” an “extensive appendix,” a glossary, outlined summaries at the start of each book, maps and other references.
You can check the play-by-play thread yourself by clicking here.
A sexist faux pas?
In explaining the development of the new bible, Geoffrey Jackson is said to have commented extensively on the work that was done – which included designing a new font set for copyright reasons.
When commenting on the new bible’s appearance and durability, Jackson is reported to have joked that it is both “witness-proof” and “sister proof.” Quite what this means isn’t immediately obvious, but it could be that he was alluding to a stereotype of women as being overly fastidious as to how an item looks rather than its content and purpose.
While many Witnesses would likely shrug off such a remark, it was undoubtedly sexist assuming, of course, that these were Jackson’s words. You could imagine the uproar if a politician on camera described the appearance of any item as “woman proof.” It would also not be the first time a Governing Body member has made a chauvinistic remark from the platform, as certain videos featuring Stephen Lett and Samuel Herd will show.
A revised translation
It seems that, rather than being an entirely new translation (which would require a new name) this new bible is a revised translation – meaning that it is predominantly an updated and improved version of the original English New World Translation.
About two years ago I was informed by a translator in a non-English bethel that it was only a matter of time before the NWT English version would be revised, because it was originally written in 1950s English whereas subsequent translators in other languages have had the luxury of rendering bible verses in a more contemporary lexicon. This prediction was clearly accurate.
A number of terms have thus been changed as follows (according to the Reddit thread)…
- “Long-suffering” is now “patience”
- “Loose conduct” is now “brazen conduct”
- “Fornication” is now “sexual immorality”
- “Impaled” is now “nailed to a stake”
- “Sheol and hades” is now “the grave”
- “Revelries” is now “wild parties”
- “Soul” is now a variety of words depending on context
- “Kidney” now means “deepest emotions”
- “In want of heart” is now “lacking good sense”
- “Sons of Israel” is now “Israelites”
- “Fatherless boy” is now “fatherless child”
- “Alien” is now “foreigner”
- “Ass” is now “donkey”
- “Impale him” is now “to the stake with him” (a regression if you ask me!)
- “Dumb demon” is now “speechless”
- “Loving kindness” is now “loyal love”
- “Jacob’s ladder” is now “Jacob’s stairway”
- and Joseph’s “coat of many colors” is now his “special robe.”
Parts of the gospels that are disputed have been removed, namely the long and short conclusions to Mark, and John 7:53-8:11. You will be familiar with these passages as the parts that appear in small font in the original version. This adjustment will doubtless not meet with widespread approval.
It will be interesting to see how certain key texts often used by Jehovah’s Witnesses to support Watchtower teachings have now been rendered, but without having seen the bible I am personally willing to trust that no attempt has been made to alter the meaning of verses or distort scripture. I will know more once I have seen the bible for myself.
Though this bible revision first-and-foremost represents a straightforward improvement to the original English, the extent of changes (i.e. removal of disputed gospel passages and addition of extra reference material) should necessitate new versions of bibles in other languages. Otherwise you would have an English bible that differs significantly in content from its non-English counterparts. The question of how and when other language versions will be introduced apparently wasn’t addressed at the annual meeting, so we will have to wait and see what transpires. [Edit: this question WAS in fact raised during the meeting, and Guy Pierce indicated that other language editions WOULD be released, but not in the immediate future.]
Replacement for Watchtower Library?
A new application is also said to have been announced at the annual meeting by Guy Pierce, with the insinuation that it will replace Watchtower Library.
“JW Library” is reported to include five other bible translations, and will be available for download from Monday 7th onwards from Google Play, the Apple Store, the Windows Store, and Amazon.
It remains to be seen whether a price will be attached to this new software. If there is, this could prove to be a very clever and unprecedented way of guaranteeing extra cash flow. However, I would rather give the organization the benefit of the doubt and assume it is a free download until I am able to check on Monday!
[Edit: I am pleased to confirm that this app is free to download. Furthermore, having listened to the announcement, I personally doubt JW Library is an immediate replacement for Watchtower Library, since it is only really designed for touch-screen devices. That said, it would not surprise me if there are long term plans for JW Library to be the successor to Watchtower Library.]
Anti-climax
In the build-up to this meeting, rumors were rife on the internet that there would be another major new scriptural understanding, or “new light,” unveiled. These rumors were understandable given the magnitude of the doctrinal changes at last year’s event, in which the Governing Body announced itself to be the faithful slave.
In opening this year’s annual meeting, Guy Pierce could be said to have somewhat goaded his audience and raised expectations unnecessarily.
This is what he reportedly said, according to DrJohnChrist…
“Will important bible questions be answered? Yes. Proverbs 4:18. There will be new light. The righteous ones (Jehovah’s people) will get the light. Will bible truths be refined at this meeting? Absolutely.”
You can arguably excuse the “bible questions” remark as a joking acknowledgment of the number of enquiries doubtless received at headquarters as to the lack of availability of bibles.
Even so, if Guy Pierce truly said the above, then he was leading his audience up a blind alley. “Bible truths” were not “refined” at this meeting, certainly not in the sense that people would understand that statement. There was no “new light.”
Again, it remains to be seen what Pierce’s exact words were, but if this is a fair representation of what he said to introduce the meeting, then in my view his words were misleading.
Question marks can also be raised over the words of another Governing Body member. In his Watchtower summary, Gerrit Lösch is reported to have said the following…
“It’s good for us not to have association with relatives who love worldly pursuits. Are our children acting worldly? Using worldly slang? Actively STEER children toward baptism. What are your children’s conversations like? Can they sing worldly songs by heart but not kingdom songs? Do I permit my children to play with worldly children? Do they talk only about kingdom interests?”
Firstly, surely children should not be “steered” or coerced into making a lifelong commitment that they cannot fully appreciate until they have matured? Is this not a main reason why so many youths get disfellowshipped and end up being shunned by their parents?
As to the remarks about “worldly” relatives, inactive “faded” Witnesses including me will once more let out a collective sigh of disappointment at the “us versus them” mentality encouraged by the Governing Body – if this is truly what Lösch said. Deprivation of normal family contact and association is yet again used as a tool for control and punishment, as with the recent convention reminders on shunning (which all but admitted that shunning is a form of emotional blackmail).
The future is bright
But despite the disappointments, I take great encouragement from this meeting. If the above information turns out to be verified, as I hope it will be over the next few days, it will represent the THIRD major leak over the past 12 months. First we had the leak of the October 2012 elder’s letter regarding child abuse. Then in March the so-called “new light” July 15th Watchtower was leaked on this website weeks in advance of its normal release.
Now we have a thinking Witness providing a live blog feed from inside a tightly controlled and confidential meeting where use of social media was expressly banned. The bravery that DrJohnChrist has shown in getting the word out is highly commendable, and I am excited to think of what other significant leaks of information we can look forward to in the near future as yet more thinking Witnesses inside the organization decide to push the boundaries and make a difference.
UPDATE: To read my follow-up article, click here. I am now in receipt of audio files for the annual meeting which correspond with the above notes, and I can confirm the accuracy of what was written in this article based on those notes. I would, however, like to clarify two aspects of DrJohnChrist’s notes that seem to be causing some confusion: (1) when Gerrit Lösch said that God’s will is to be completed by the end of the millennium, this has given some the impression that Lösch was referring to the end of this century, when in fact he was referring to the end of Christ’s millennial rule, and (2) the phrase “bum witnesses” was never used in Lösch’s talk. The word “bum” was used once in Anthony Morris’ talk, but only in an illustration.
Further reading…
Related videos…
Cedars,
I don’t think the reply button to specific comments is working for everyone. Mine are going under the persons comment I’m hitting reply under…
Thank you for such incredible coverage the past few weeks.
Frank,
If you are asking me to define victim as pertains to my comment, the simple contex I’m using it in is a defenseless child that has had their innocence stolen by a pedofile.
Of course, their are additional definitions, but I’m not sure who your question was directed to.
Bill, using upper case letters and accusing folks of spreading lies that they can’t prove has helped no one. Not one person.
The fact is, the plethora of problems facing the leadership of your religion are publicly manifest. Court cases are facts. The Secret elders book is a fact. Fact following fact.
You are entitled to your opinion, but don’t accuse people of lying unless you can prove it.
If you are a faithful witness, then you shouldn’t be reading or posting on this site anyway!! You’ve been very clearly told not to, haven’t you?
THERE IS NO SECRET ELDERS BOOK, IF THERE WAS HOW COME EVERYONE KNOWS ABOUT IT?
Bill, that comment is so silly it speaks for itself. The elder’s book is secret because only elders are allowed to read it – it’s not that hard to grasp.
And stop writing in upper case, or you will be blocked from commenting.
Wow! What a witness bombing this has been! I’ve never seen so many unhappy witnesses posting here before, accusing us of lying, cowardice and a host of downright lies too!
I think that we have really p####d off the leadership! and they are breaking their own rules on visiting apostate sites to write in block capitals and get very rude.
It shows that we are having an effect on them now.
Bill, the reason “everyone knows about it” is because we have looked it up online and read it. Don’t be obtuse.
My relative is a baptised witness in good standing. They have no knowledge of the shepherding the flock of god book.
The witnesses state that their organisation is based on the 1st century Christian church, yes?
There was no part of the bible that was for elders only. There was never an example of judgement when the defendant didn’t have access to the same information as the accuser in the bible. Never once.
This non secret book contains specific information on many issues that are discussed on this site.
The ordinary witnesses have no idea that the shepherding the flock of god book exists.
If the book isn’t secret, then let all witnesses own a copy.
I see that you can’t resist the old capitals again, can you?
Please read the articles on this site and then check them with the publications. Then, only then, can you come on this site and accuse folks of lying.
I have spent enough time responding to you. I really have no interest in your ill informed opinion and you hectoring ways. Go read the articles and maybe, just maybe, you can make Jesus proud.
To Gary Watson (post #21):
My friend, in matt.10:22, who is speaking about the heatred againt the disciples? Jesus or Yahweh? so much so, on account of whose name YOU are being “hated”?
Are you hated by Me or Cedars, on account of Jesus…? or on account of …Jehovah.
Jesus never even used this name jehova since it – the name jehovah – was INVENTED by a catholic(??!!!) monk in the year 1270 AD. Go figure!
By the way, read again the wt magazine entitled “the divine name that will endure forever” or the wt encyclopedia called “aid to bible understanding” under the subject “jehova” and compare it within the “Insight book”.
I never understood the phrase “sister proof.”
If I live in a house and I say my house is “burglar proof” that means burglars can’t get inside my house. So what about this New World Translation being “sister proof?” Does it mean that sisters can’t understand it? Or what?
I think this moron, like all the morons governing the JWs, was wrong in his speech.
Gypsy Sam, please be assured I have investigated everything, from Malawi, UNGO, Beth Sarim to “flip flops”, child abuse……trust me EVERYTHING. The Internet is great for this. Apostates have very “helpful” sites on EVERYTHING. The none apostate internet i.e. professional, historical etc. is great for gathering FACTS. So I read, and I investigated, and I asked questions. I don’t know what you investigated, and what questions you asked but I found answers to mine. This place is not the right place to discuss this as you can appreciate it would take pages and pages…..
Just one thing I would like to mention. Have you investigated the whole issue of child abuse? I mean from a professional, secular and societal point of view? (not religious). I encourage you to do so. You will then be better able to piece together the whole problematic of this sad “sign of the times”. And you will realize it is not as simple as you make it sound. If you want I will post some links on here.
“The none apostate internet i.e. professional, historical etc. is great for gathering FACTS.”
I find that statement most curious in the context of a discussion on Watchtower. Precisely which non-Watchtower non-Apostate online treasure-troves of Watchtower-related information are you visiting? The only one I can think of is Wikipedia, and that is essentially a battleground between JW-apologist contributors and their apostate adversaries with Wikipedia’s rules on eligibility acting as referee. Watchtower nearly always wins the eligibility battle by the way because it’s easier for them to publish books, and if something didn’t appear in a book or newspaper according to Wikipedia it didn’t happen.
I have to say you sink further in my estimation when you say that you have studied the UN/NGO scandal, the Mexico/Malawi outrage and the epidemic of child abuse within the organization as brought about by Watchtower’s fixation with the two-witness rule, and you are somehow OK with it all. That either suggests to me that you have mastered cognitive dissonance to a superlative level, or you are fine with innocent people suffering. Which is it?
Hi Greg, you say Catholics don’t judge trinitarian Christians, which suggests you think Catholics don’t believe in the trinity. Correct me if I’m wrong, but surely Catholics believing in the trinity is a fundamental aspect of Catholicism in the first place?
Lol…hahahahah you know what my dear Tom? Jws will simply tell you that, that moron and his “sister proof” speech, is the “thinkingest” gringo the earth never carry. We in the south we tell them: bless your heart!
No Cedar, no cognitive dissonance here, just an open mind and objectivity. I have studied it all with a neutral attitude. And no, not Wikipedia and no WT. I am sure you are aware that there are other sites, and if you are picky enough and they meet the criterion of being unbiased, objective and neutral and are based exclusively on research and facts, not someones opinion, (even some scholarly articles are biased) then you are on the right track. I must admit, sometimes they are hard to find, but they are there.
If your mind is so open that it is ok for men to rape children and get away with it so long as nobody else saw them, then it is very open indeed.
And I notice you avoid giving us these wondrous sites that are neither Watchtower nor apostate. Without bombarding us with URLs, could you perhaps name them?
Secrecy? yes indead!!! Bill. the letter sent to the Elders along with the shepherd Book stated clearly that the Elders are to keep that book out of sight, from non Elders. Even the sisters(!!),wives of elders ARE NOT allowed even to handle it, the content being con-fi-den-tial.
Now Bill, do you have a copy of that book?
If yes, have you shown it to a “dear friend”?
R u serious! All of this whining & complaining, over revisions to the NWT. The KJ is still the KJ and can be viewed soon along with other bibles and original scriptural books/text, whatever. No one is hiding anything. The original words r still there n the new bible as well. Can’t all ye understand that. Who speaks that way now? We can hardly understand each other. I appreciate that dont have to struggle to understand. I use both the KJ & NWT. Did the King Jame of Britain, France & England really care about slaves, black people, the diverse spanish nationalities, etc, etc to understand the bible? There needs to be translationsin every language. It’s a translation! Da! In many languages there are not even certain words for every english word. I’m happy they are trying on a world wide scale. Things take time. I love them. Brush of the bitter haters and keep on keeping on JW’s. May all ye chill.
Sister proof. The bibles are used a lot and in time the wear starts to show that is all. So what women any person would not want bible to look nice for as long as possible in public?
But Jackson had already said the bibles were “witness proof.” This surely encompasses all witnesses, both men and women. Why the need to go on and say they were “sister proof?”
Y is all of the good recent comments about JW’s placed on the bottom. This website is full of pure hate. Thus all ye getta grip. Lol
Thousands of women recieved the new bibles!!!
Do you and everyone reading know what logical fallacies and cognitive dissonance mean and involve? I did not and stayed in denial for some time until my teen and I researched them.
My bible studies and teenager asked legitimate questions based on faith in God and sincerely wanting to please him and the elders could not answer anything about Johannes Greber and the NWT, misquotes about earthquakes and JW divorce statistics. The list goes on.
Also, why does the main jw.org page say we don’t shun yet any truthful witness knows we do and are encouraged not to even say hello or email family that is out? Where is that in the Bible, old or new version?
Until I saw how many people I personally knew were being shunned by JW family (including quite small children…what kind of loving grandparent is that) I was in a delusional bubble, too.
Does this revised Bible only support JW doctrine a.k.a, a successful book publishing company that evades taxes?
Jesus must be shaking his head.
I suggest Col 1.23
Funny how that gospel got around the world faster then the kingdom gospel. ;)
Its all about Jesus regardless of what the GB says.
Dear Gary, if there’s any hate, it is coming from the Watchtower Society encouraging Jehovah’s Witnesses to hate anything and anyone “worldly”. Anywho, that verse you quoted says believers will be hated “on account of my name”, or Jesus’s name, which is what non-JW Christians are truly being persecuted for. Also if there’s any hate you perceive coming from the world, it’s because of Watchtower Society’s leadership actions and policies; not hatred towards Witnesses. Get it straight, please! Try to get a copy of the Watchtower Library CD. You can do much research using that alone and find out the lies, dishonesty, doublespeak, hypocrisy, etc.
@Janett
To answer your question from Monday. I was not on the comittee. However I was at the hospital after her suicide attempt as she requested my wife and I visit which we did. Her fervent step father wanted her helped to see how she needed to repent and all of this would go away. I took a very different direction. I contacted the elders on the comittee and warned them of the legal action that would be taken if they did not correct this matter immediately. She was reinstated in a record 2 months from the date of her disfellowshipping.
As for the other wrongdoing. I will try to make it brief. Our Service Overseer’s sons, none of them got baptized and one of them had smoked at his parents house since he was 14. His father claimed not to have known. He also fornicated with several young girls and a couple of young boys. He even was so brazen as to place his smoking and drinking on facebook for the whole world to see. When the pictures were shown to his father he claimed they were not of his son. Every elder could plainly see that it was, as it was mainly headshots with cigarettes and whiskey bottles. His other 2 children followed in his footsteps. No action was ever taken against the father.
Our Coordinator who was in his 80s had a 45 year old son who was not scripturally free to marry. However his son was engaged to another woman in a hall and Our Service Overseer who knew this was going to give the talk until I demanded we call World Headquarters. The told us that he was to be dealt with judicially but the coordinator blocked it. When I brought this to the attention of the C.O. he was rewarded with a talk at the Circuit Assembly.
Our School Overseer’s son 42 years old left his wife without scriptural basis and went and lived with his father. He regularly berated his wife, this my wife and I witnessed with our own eyes and ears. She told us that he had told her he already had a girlfriend and would be married soon. While harboring his worthless son, sadly this fine woman took her life! It was tragic! Worse than this they deleted a servant for allowing his non believing son to live with him even though his son had no job and needed help.
I served on a comittee with our 2 remaining elders in regards to a man who viewed pornography. His wife had caught him and he came to confess. This man was childish and immature, but not a bad person. The other brothers confessed to me they really did not like him. They decided he should be disfellowshipped. I resisted because I felt we should try to help the man and his marriage. they adamantly disagreed and I lost. He was disfellowshipped. A few months later one of the 2 elders confessed to me that he heard voices at the Kingdom Hall during the meetings. Why you ask? He was taking strong antidepressants. Why? He was battling depression because he had a serious problem with pornography. What a hypocrite! Worse yet, I told all of this to the new C.O. and the D.O. and they told me Jehovah would take care of it in time. Which I have learned to mean, we are going to do nothing so forget about it and if something bad happens to these guys we will call it Jehovah.
I can provide names. Names of the sweet dear woman who took her life leaving behind her 3 year old daughter, the piece of garbage self appointed congregation lords from which I resigned and never will be a part of again. Names of the 3 other suicides that were caused by shunning, one of which was my brother-in-law, he was a gentle, decent and good mand who needed help and instead was given a punishment that is outlawed by the Geneva Convention.
One last example is Disaster Relief. Here is a simple question for you and any Witnesses reading this website. Why would the WTBS promote disaster relief and not help local brothers and sisters who have lost jobs with their mortgages and food and even help pay some health care?
Is it money? Examine the facts. During disaster relief, their is very often government money, as well as insurance money. The Disaster relief committee even assists in filing the government and insurance paperwork making sure the witnesses get their checks. Those checks are then turned over to the WTBS under the guise of the Worldwide Work. Those checks in most cases are based on retail pricing of businesses doing the work. How do I know this, I owned a business that was very successful doing this type of work, 2 huge differences though. I paid my laborers and I got them proper training. When disaster struck our state they showed up with little to no training they enlisted (enslaved) the local brothers. Sadly many were removing Category 3 contaminants without proper respirators, in other cases they used drying fans and dehumidifiers without treating the bacteria and contaminents in the homes. Sadly, one family paid the ultimate price. They had mold growing out of their walls just 3 months after the comittee left and their father died as a result of the VOCs (Volatilie Organic Compounds) in the air, truly senseless. The congregation gave him a send off with the promise he would be raised again in paradise as the WTBTS kept his money.
Again ask the question. If I got sick would the WTBTS help pay for my medical expenses? They have private doctors at Bethel, paid for by you. You don’t. If I needed my mortgage paid due to no fault of my own isn’t that a disaster that needs relief? They will not pay it, because they will not get the government or insurance companies to pay them back at an incredible profit, so they are not interested. They claim they formed the disaster relief comitttee to help the brothers, but the truth is they are fleecing them because most publishers are broke already, they found a new income stream and disguised it as help, when they in no way are interested in helping anyone but themselves, unless of course it gets them personally some glory and even then it is very limited.
You are truly torturing yourself with such extreme beliefs that the WTS is scanning your phone records to entrap you. Do there not exist Privacy Laws and Laws regarding eavesdropping via electronic media and the like? There are far more exciting and notable issues to pursue regarding doctrinal changes and the like. Lets use our powers of reason.
Gary, there are many organisations (religious and otherwise) that are ‘hated’. If this is the main reason why you attend their meetings (your words), then it’s quite shallow reasoning. I used to be a witness and now I don’t ‘hate’ them. I wish some of them were still my friends, but they have chosen not to be my friends, for fear that I might poison them.
I’m sure they have more hatred for me than I have for them.
It’s another example, Gary, of clutching at one straw to try to prove the ‘truth’, and ignoring the rafter of irregularities that blind the other eye (sorry about the mixing of metaphors, but I’m sure you get the point!).
To clarify, being hated was just one of the points Jesus made…don’t hang onto that and ignore the rest
Jannet says:
“No Cedar, no cognitive dissonance here, just an open mind and objectivity. I have studied it all with a neutral attitude.”
“Gypsy Sam, please be assured I have investigated everything……trust me EVERYTHING. The Internet is great for this. Apostates have very “helpful” sites on EVERYTHING.”
“As for trusting the “8 men”, I have had no reason to distrust them so far.”
“Every witness has (or should have) its finger on the pulse of the organization and know what is going on. And most witnessed do. There is no excuse not to, as the society does inform, via its magazines, and recently via the JW website. If you miss something, then its because you are not paying attention and are a “drifter” or part time JW.”
So Jannet, were you “paying attention” to the following article when it was considered at the Watchtower study during the week of September 5-11, 2011? :
*** w11 7/15 p. 16 pars. 6-7 Will You Heed Jehovah’s Clear Warnings? ***
“How can we protect ourselves against false teachers? The Bible’s counsel….is clear. (Read Romans 16:17; 2 John 9-11) “Avoid them,” says God’s Word. Other translations render that phrase “turn away from them,” “keep away from them,” and “stay away from them!” There is nothing ambiguous about that inspired counsel….apostates are “mentally diseased”….(1 Tim. 6:3, 4) Jehovah, the Great Physician, tells us to avoid contact with them….are we determined to heed his warning in all respects? What is involved in avoiding false teachers? We do not receive them into our homes or greet them…. refuse to read their literature…. examine their Web sites, or add our comments to their blogs. Why do we take such a firm stand? Because of love. We love “the God of truth”….(Ps. 31:5; John 17:17)….Why, then, allow yourself to be soured by anyone who would denigrate the organization….?”
So, Jannet do you have your “finger on the pulse” of the “organization”? If so, and if you have “no reason to distrust” the “governing body” as you claim, then why are you here viewing and posting on this web site in obviously complete and utter disregard of the clearly stated counsel in the aforementioned Watchtower article? By disobediently ignoring that counsel are you demonstrating that you “have your finger on the pulse” of the “organization” and that you really “trust” the “governing body”?
Loyal JW’s who adhere to God’s counsel, as expressed by the “governing body” in the Watchtower magazine, are expected to take a “firm stand” and “refuse” to “examine web sites” such as this one or “add comments” to their blogs. But please don’t leave just yet, as I have some additional thought provoking comments and observations to make in reply to some of your other postings.
A Man For All Seasons
4th Generation JW
Jannet says:
“No Cedar, no cognitive dissonance here, just an open mind and objectivity. I have studied it all with a neutral attitude.”
“Gypsy Sam, please be assured I have investigated everything……trust me EVERYTHING. The Internet is great for this. Apostates have very “helpful” sites on EVERYTHING.”
“As for trusting the “8 men”, I have had no reason to distrust them so far.”
“Every witness has (or should have) its finger on the pulse of the organization and know what is going on. And most witnessed do. There is no excuse not to, as the society does inform, via its magazines, and recently via the JW website. If you miss something, then its because you are not paying attention and are a “drifter” or part time JW.”
Well, Jannet, were you paying attention to the following article at the Watchtower study during the week of September 5-11, 2011?:
*** w11 7/15 p. 16 pars. 6-7 Will You Heed Jehovah’s Clear Warnings? ***
“How can we protect ourselves against false teachers? The Bible’s counsel….is clear. (Read Romans 16:17; 2 John 9-11) “Avoid them,” says God’s Word. Other translations render that phrase “turn away from them,” “keep away from them,” and “stay away from them!” There is nothing ambiguous about that inspired counsel….apostates are “mentally diseased”….(1 Tim. 6:3, 4) Jehovah, the Great Physician, tells us to avoid contact with them….are we determined to heed his warning in all respects? What is involved in avoiding false teachers? We do not receive them into our homes or greet them…. refuse to read their literature…. examine their Web sites, or add our comments to their blogs. Why do we take such a firm stand? Because of love. We love “the God of truth”….(Ps. 31:5; John 17:17)…. Why, then, allow yourself to be soured by anyone who would denigrate the organization….”
So, Jannet, is it evident that you really have your “finger on the pulse” of the “organization”? If so, and if you have “no reason to distrust” the “governing body” as you claim, then why are you here viewing and posting on this web site in obviously complete and utter disregard of the clearly stated counsel in the aforementioned Watchtower article? Why would you comment: “Apostates have very “helpful” sites on EVERYTHING.” By disobediently ignoring the counsel are you demonstrating that you really have your “finger on the pulse” of the “organization” and that you “trust” and “respect” the “governing body”?
Loyal JW’s are expected to “refuse to examine” such web sites or “add comments” to their blogs. But please don’t leave just yet, as I have some additional thought provoking insights and comments in reply to some of your other postings.
A Man For All Seasons
4th Generation JW
Cedars,
Didn’t you know confidential is different from secret?
I have never been an elder and read it too. If I was allowed to read it before I got baptized, I would never have got baptized or encouraged my daughter to do so at 14yrs
70wks…
“A simple man believes every word he hears; a clever man understands the need for proof.” (Prov. 14:15 ~ The New English Bible)
“But do most people carefully analyze the real issues involved….? Or do they just accept what they are told?” ~ Awake 2000, 6/22, pg.6 par.10
A Man For All Seasons
4th Generation JW
Janet- you are right you are not privy to every case. You know what the elders want you to know. Thats it!
The elders told me not to go to the police, see my posts on JWN to get the full picture if you want it. My case is not unique.
Go get yourself the full picture. Check out jwfacts from the links page on this site, because I assure you, you do not have all the facts.
70wksofyrs
Jannet,
I have read all your comments carefully and as a woman, I think you put women to shame.
You have made sweeping generalisations without knowing all the facts, and really reveal your inability to be open minded.
Take care Jannet
70wks…
Cedars,
Great work dealing with the influx of nosey, active, JWs who want to know more about the NNWT.
I can see your desire to help them even if their manner is unpalatable, well done with that!
I agree with gypsy Sam, there appears to be a problem with the reply button
Regards
70wks……….
Jannet, … In your investigations did you consider this:
“Shocking as it is, even some who have been prominent in Jehovah’s organization have succumbed to immoral practices, including homosexuality, wife swapping, and child molesting. It is to be noted, also, that during the past year, 36,638 individuals had to be disfellowshipped from the Christian congregation, the greater number of them for practicing immorality. Jehovah’s organization must be kept clean!” (w86 1/1 p. 13 par. 12)!
Jannet, do you want to convince us “Noah’s day” are aver now? That “Jehovah’s organization” is clean?
You mind is not yet open!! It will open when an Elder touches your genitals!! “Momentary touching of another’s genitals, even if intentional, would generally not be considered porneia.” says the letter dated March 6, 2012 TO ALL BODIES OF ELDERS, Reminders from Kingdom Ministry School held during 2011 service year.
You need to investigate Deuteronomy 28:28, I am afraid this prophecy is being fulfilled today in JWs community!! Watch out!!
I thought they were translating the bible into ebonics.
Didn’t they used to stone false prophets? The governing body may want to start wearing helmets. How often have they said the world will end? Why would anyone listen to any of their nonsense?
Stay alive til 75! Yeah baby! I’m waiting for 1975, because the world is going to end!
Did you know that the nephew of Franz said that in 1975 when they were telling everyone the world was going to end, that the heads of the Watchtower Soceity had a stock portfolio worth millions of dollars, and they were buying and buying stock up at the same time they were telling all the brothers and sisters that the world was going to end? Anyone see anything wrong with that.
Do you also know that in the last few years the Watchtower Society has had a representative go to various hedge fund meetings that are attended by large banks?
Wake up Jehovah’s Witness suckers.
My relative who is a JW said the reason they came out with the new bible was to make the language more basic, because lots of brothers and sisters were having trouble with some of the words, like the word “contend”. That is what was said at her meeting.
I guess that just goes to show how many dumb brothers and sisters there are.
By the way, did anyone see the video of Sparlock the Warrior Wizard on Youtube. The Watchtower Society made an animated video showing a child playing with a toy bear, and the bear is wearing a wizard’s hat. The mother sees this, and asks the boy “Who likes magic? Jehovah or Satan?” She then shames the boy into throwing the bear in the trash.
Well, I’m just wondering why my relative and all her JW sisters have multiple Disney dvds and videos which have all kinds of magic in them. Shouldn’t they throw away any Disney movies that have any kind of supernatural magic in them, since only the devil likes magic?
Hypocrites.
Yes, I agree that all disney movies should be thrown out but shouldn’t that be the same for all people claiming to be christian and living their life for Christ.
Justin
Cedar asked you if you were aware of the Watchtowers membership as a NGO in the United Nation. You made no comment concerning his question. Are you aware of this or have looked into the matter? If you are aware of the truth concerning this membership, how does that make you feel or think? You have stated that others here are liars, so as to not be a false witness or slandering others, have you checked it out? This this not fair?
If you do, don’t trust the internet and don’t go back too the Kingdom Hall and tell other Witness or the Elders, call the brothers at the Watchtower and they will tell you that they were Member of the Great Beast until they were exposed in the Guardian news paper in 2001. Cedar was not lying and have you asked yourself why the Governing Body has not addressed to the rest of the Witness of there Apostate membership while denouncing the Great Beast.
If you check this out you will find out that this real truth. Then ask yourself why the Watchtower won’t tell their brother the true? Bad PR? That they are Apostate to their own beliefs? Or maybe this, they might ask you where did you learn such crazy things. If I were you, I wound not tell them I learned the truth online.
Justin, in the end they don’t have to address this issue, they hole the keys to the new world order and if you hold there feet to the fire you might lose your family to real truths or what I like to call facts. They have nothing to fear from you or any of their member but they will stand before the courts in these child abuse lawsuits which you will soon be giving the Watchtower your money. As you put it “Let the time be the witness” But have you noticed that the Tower is asking for more money than they ever have before even though they just sold off a Billion Dollar property.
Please reply to the question of your understanding of membership in the UN. Thanks
Ralph… I am afraid they can have find a Biblical response to their nonsense:
(Ecclesiastes 9:11) . . .I returned to see under the sun that the swift do not have the race, nor the mighty ones the battle, nor do the wise also have the food, nor do the understanding ones also have the riches, nor do even those having knowledge have the favor; . . .
If not convinced, they will further tell you that:
(1 Corinthians 1:21) . . .God saw good through the foolishness of what is preached to save those believing.
Fooloshness = their nonsense
the 2013 nwt is a revision of a non-translation. I don’t know if there is a word for a document that borrows from presumably various other translations and then alters the text in most places to fit preconceived doctrinal beliefs (e.g. Christ-deity, see Col 1.16, insertion of word ‘other’ etc).
There could have been no going back to the original languages in this 2013 ed. because the 1953 never did.
Justin, you are right to say you are immature! You should be ashamed to call a self appointed cult “God’s People”!! You should be ashamed of this, from w86 1/1 p. 13 par. 12
Shocking as it is, even some who have been prominent in Jehovah’s organization have succumbed to immoral practices, including homosexuality, wife swapping, and child molesting. It is to be noted, also, that during the past year, 36,638 individuals had to be disfellowshipped from the Christian congregation, the greater number of them for practicing immorality. Jehovah’s organization must be kept clean!
“Jehovah’s organization must be kept clean!” Is that a WISH, a DREAM, an ORDER, … well I can understand now what you call “God’s People”!! Jehavah’s Witnesses say about Memorial partakers. “A number of factors—including past religious beliefs or even mental or emotional imbalance—might cause some to assume mistakenly that they have the heavenly calling.” (w11 8/15 p. 22)!!
By ANALOGY with this “A number of factors might cause some to assume mistakenly that they are God’s People”!
Upon this, I urge you to consult a Mental Health Specialist, your immaturity must hide a big Psychological Disorder….
I read that in the 1950’s that some of the JW’s were on trial somewhere, and their main “translator” was up before the judge, and the judge asked him to translate a page of Hebrew text, and he couldn’t do it. Meaning the JW’s just make up their own version of the bible to suit their needs.