Those who follow my YouTube channel will be familiar with my “Getting To Know You” series of videos, which I’ve been producing for some time.
These short films use selected clips from Governing Body talks to reveal the character and intellect of Governing Body members, who now consider themselves collectively to be the “faithful and discreet slave.”
By far the stand-out performer from this series has been Anthony Morris III (or “Tony” Morris as his friends call him). While other Governing Body members tend to be quite guarded and diplomatic when it comes to voicing their personal opinions, Tony has a seemingly insatiable appetite for offloading his private ponderings on bewildered audiences as though these are part of some divine revelation.
As Tony himself is so fond of putting it, “I’m just a shoemaker. If the shoe fits, well you have to wear it. Don’t get mad at me. This is Jehovah’s Word, this is what’s been outlined by the Governing Body. Just take a look at yourself.”
Until now I have contentedly followed Tony’s advice and refused to get “mad” at him. It is clear from listening to his talks (as I have done for many hours over the past two years) that he is a deluded crackpot who loves the limelight and thinks very highly of himself. The “shoe” always seems to fit anyone but him. Even so, I have been willing to give him the benefit of the doubt regarding his character. I have assumed that he is essentially a kind-hearted soul suffering from serious delusional issues.
But then I listened to the recording from his recent zone visit to the Italian Branch Office in Rome, and my opinion quickly changed.
If you would like to listen to the talk yourself, you will find a recording at the foot of this article, or on this link. But make yourself comfortable! It is over an hour-and-a-half long, and half in Italian.
From what I can gather, the talk was given on January 5th in Rome as part of a Zone Visit, and was broadcast live to another audience in Israel. The discourse was translated into Italian with the aid of an interpreter.
For those who don’t have 90 minutes to spare on listening to the entire talk, here are my notes of what was discussed (timings are approximate)…
- 01:40 – Tony toys with his audience about the new revised English New World Translation, and tells them they should have “pazienza” because he won’t be releasing a new Bible in Italian on this visit. (One brother later commented by email that this did NOT go down well with everyone, since Italians are more interested in whether their Branch Office will stay open than whether they are getting a new Bible.)
- 16:00 – Tony asks how many families in the audience have visited the local amusement park, Gardaland, but never the local Branch Office in Rome. To such ones he says, “Explain that to Jehovah. That’s a problem.”
- 22:00 – “When your family gets together to eat a meal, shut that thing off,” barks Tony when expressing himself regarding the television.
- 26:00 – Tony says to families who don’t eat together on a daily basis, “Guess what, the devil has attacked you in your family.”
- 30:00 – “Family worship needs to be more important than what we eat,” declares Tony, after a rather patronizing analogy involving pasta.
- 35:35 – Tony tells parents who aren’t prepared to “strengthen the spirituality” of their children ahead of Armageddon that they might as well “Sit ’em down and say goodbye. Jehovah is never sentimental.”
- 39:00 – Tony begins a rant against “extremely tight pants,” and goes on to suggest that these are an elaborate conspiracy on the part of homosexual fashion designers, who “just love it” when they see men wearing tight pants. Clearly rattled by the audience’s bemused response, Tony presses the issue and explains how when given similar “discipline” in America, Witnesses “threw those pants away, even though they spent considerable money on them.”
- 44:00 – Tony remarks that there are a few ties in the audience that there is “no way” he would wear, even though deciding on which tie to wear is a “personal choice” and Witnesses do not need to dress “prudishly.”
- 46:00 – Witnesses should not wear clothing that “enters the room before they do” in the style of Lady Gaga.
- 48:30 – Tony says of King David, “When he’s resurrected, you tell him I spoke fondly of him!” The way the talk is going, I’m not sure he would welcome that endorsement.
- 49:20 – “She doesn’t like it when she gets into my talks,” Tony says of Mrs Morris, with whom it’s easy to sympathize.
- 53:50 – Tony bemoans films featuring vampires. “Are they dead or are they alive?” he muses.
- 55:00 to 56:19 – The feed goes silent, presumably due to a technical problem. Audience members have opportunity to conduct a quick visual audit of tight pants and flamboyant ties.
- 01:00:00 – Tony relates the story of a father who would pray each night for his children to “never have to be dealt with by a judicial committee.”
- 01:01:00 – Tony quips that Italians can be “excitable sometimes.”
- 01:04:00 – A strange bike story is related in which a dog ends up being “the only one in the whole house that behaved like a Christian.” You can’t help but wonder whether it was wearing appropriate legwear.
- 01:07:00 – Those who aren’t preaching the “good news of the kingdom” have blood on their hands, which God can see.
- 01:14:00 – “When I finally get to heaven I hope he says ‘what a reward’,” Tony says of the mentor who took his Bible study – also of the professed anointed.
- 01:14:50 – Tony begins a discussion on shunning, using misapplied scripture and a dubious second-hand experience to reinforce the idea that the practice should be enforced within the family. Any who speak to disfellowshipped loved ones must repent.
- 01:25:00 – Tony concludes by relating the story of a Witness who impressed police with her “unbreakable faith” following the death of her daughter, who was murdered by another Witness.
- 01:31:30 – Tony indulges himself and his audience in a make-believe conversation between two mothers from “five hundred years after the thousand-year reign has finished,” or “fifteen hundred years into the future.” I guess that means Armageddon IS coming this year then.
Of all the examples of delusion and eccentricity in Tony’s talk, arguably his homophobic rant against tight pants was the most jaw-dropping. Rarely has a Governing Body member been known to disgorge such an opinionated torrent of bigotry and small-mindedness quite so publicly and all at once.
On hearing the tight pants tirade I set about making the above video, along with another longer version featuring a humorous Will Ferrell skit at the end. It demonstrated perfectly, in my mind, how outrageous this man is. Anyone listening to Tony’s pant-related musings would struggle to associate them with a man professing to be one eighth of Christ’s “faithful and discreet slave.”
The question must surely be asked by any reasonable person, “If someone as nutty and narrow-minded as Tony Morris can be a member of the Governing Body, surely can’t anyone?”
A glimpse of true evil
It was only later, once I’d listened to the Rome talk in its entirety and fallen upon the part on shunning that my blood really began to boil and the dying embers of any respect I might have once held for Tony were finally snuffed out.
The gloves came off. I felt compelled to make another video – this time in the form of a rebuttal.
As explained in the above video rebuttal, I have come to the conclusion that Tony Morris is an evil and dangerous man. Why do I make this assertion?
Tony’s staunch defense of shunning displayed, not just ignorance and stupidity, but a concerted and cynical effort to deceive. The clearest example of this came when Tony declared: “We don’t have closed doors at kingdom halls, ropes to tie people into seats. We do this because we volunteer to become Jehovah’s people.” In uttering these words, Tony told two bare-faced lies in quick succession – both of which were aimed at manipulating his audience into adopting his point of view.
First, Tony’s “closed doors” statement implied that Witnesses are free to leave the religion whenever they choose. As one of many who are currently having their family used as a weapon against them as punishment for doing precisely that, I can personally vouch to the dishonesty of this statement.
Second, Tony suggested that all Jehovah’s Witnesses are “volunteers,” which implies that all enter the religion without coercion, at an age of maturity, and with all pertinent facts regarding the organization and its history at their disposal.
In making this latter claim, Tony must have been hoping that nobody would remember a talk he gave to an audience in America in which he recommended that parents blackmail children who reach the age of 16 without getting baptized by witholding money for their driving license. Anyone who is cajoled into joining an organization before they reach maturity and as a result of blackmail can most certainly not be called a “volunteer” in any reasonable sense.
Bereft of a clear scriptural mandate for shunning between family members, Tony subjected his audience to a second-hand half-baked “experience,” in which a disfellowshipped man who wasn’t completely shunned by his family for 20 years turned around on his reinstatement and berated his family as “disloyal” for inviting him to their annual family gatherings.
Here too, I found evidence of malevolence in Tony’s character. Those listening to the dubious story were being asked to respect the sort of person who would be ungrateful and duplicitous enough to avail himself of love, kindness and hospitality for 20 years and only berate his family members for their “disloyalty” once it was convenient for him to do so.
In my opinion, the story showed all the signs of having been concocted by a depraved mind, and represented a desperate attempt on Tony’s part to dupe his audience into believing that those being shunned WILL come back some day if only “loyal” Witnesses will stifle their innate morality and subject disfellowshipped loved ones to cruelty and ostracism.
Whether the story was true or not, it only gave further validation to my new consideration of Tony Morris as an evil and dangerous man. He is evil for holding as laudible the heartless words of a cynical opportunist, and trying to trick his audience and pull the wool over their eyes on such an emotive and far-reaching issue as shunning.
And he is dangerous because he is so clearly deluded and yet, along with his cohorts, controls the lives of 8 million worshippers around the world – all of whom are under strict orders to obey any commands “whether these appear sound from a strategic or human standpoint or not.” (w13 11/15 p.20)
I can only hope that the bolder Tony becomes whenever a microphone is positioned before his incontinent mouth, the more people will see him for who he truly is.
134 thoughts on “Deluded or dangerous? – My thoughts on Anthony Morris III following his Rome visit”
I was wondering where do you find all of theses recordings of Anthony Morris. I tried to find the one that was linked to your Getting To Know Series part 11 but it is no longer their.
In the first century, those who were to be shunned were not allowed to attend their get together. Today the Governing Body makes it a rule that in order to be reinstated, one has to be regular in meeting attendance. Apparently it shows a repentant attitude. So much for priding themselves as imitators of first century Christianity.
Nice article Cedars. I love how this radical thinking process still continues from men who believe they are divinely inspired by God. I have been given plenty of insight over the years and making hasty generalizations only makes them look like fools. I had once considered on forcing myself to go back to be with family but I would likely cause more chaos than good. I see things sharper than I ever did inside this religion. I have been blessed more after I left than when I was a member. No man has the authority under God to judge or condemn others unless given so. I do not see these men worthy of such a heavy responsibility. I understand their views to protect against negative thinking but at what expense are they going to in which more harm is created. Advising is acceptable but demanding with fear is never the correct way to teach others. They do not truly follow Jesus footsteps as he has shown us how to be as followers. Jehovah and his son Jesus are saddened by this group and will clean his people from this false way of thinking. Love from an ex-brother to all those still trapped in your own religious despair. Thanks Cedar you have healed me from years of pain and sadness by giving me an outlet to share my views. Bless you and your family.
Brilliant! Loving all the hard work you’re doing.
I’m off the opinion the Tony Morris is possibly boozed up to the eyeballs.
I mean, sure I totally agree his opinions are nutty and self serving. But it’s his rambling deliver thats making me wonder whether he might be under the influence of ‘man-made spirits’ instead of just satanic ones!
I sometimes need to steel myself to come to the site and read your posts. They are appalling, frightening, hilarious, creepy and embarrassing, all at once. They bring back wave after wave of memories, and while the mix of emotions can be heady, it is good for me to feel them, like a booster shot of an inoculation, so I won’t ever be infected again. Thank you for the work you do.
So I know I am late to the party on this thread, but if you still need a copy of the much-hailed “silver sword”, I have one I would be happy to send to you (a “gift” from my family). I couldn’t possibly wish a better use for it.
Interesting that someone said the society is watching this site, but they tell us its dangerous, Real Deal, only one thing to say, if you don;t like what you read here go away, i am an active JW, i am finding it harder & harder to preach & go to meetings, if i was in Italy i woulnt waste it listening to Mickey Mouse, they are to many of these clowns who love the sound of their own voices on the platform, if i made the mistake of being in the room i would walk out, my Wife & i, have chosen not to go to the upcoming international convention in Melbourne due to the out of control cost, i am sick of the propoganda, scare mongering idiots, beleive & worship Jehovah not the egotists.
Good for you, Warren. I have never come across a JW who has regretted leaving the outfit. Indeed most of us find life improves no end; even those for whom the penalties of being shunned are severe.
So sad to see someone like that is over so many people. I was in the truth for years and know hes a hateful haughty person ,, traits not of Gods spirit but Satan’s spirit.
So when do the people from another planet land to take us away happen,is this man for real that he is so full of self deluded opinions to the point he is worse than some fundelmentalist bible belt basher,this is so funny yet so dangerous to the point people would listen to a man like this,but don’t forget they are helped by the holy spirit!!!!!!!,sounds like the only spirit this man gets is to much thats to much 40% proof that is……..
I could not agree more with what you have said about this “brother”. He was tied in at the convention. Everyone said he was so loving so real. I immediately th ok ought he was an actor and sounded so fake. Your thoughts reaffirmed what I already thought. Thank you for all you do and post. It has been very helpful in mine and my husband’s fading process. We are still very new to this.
Good ‘Ole Tony will be speaking at the Twickenham International Convention in the UK later this month. His scary visage is emblazoned on the flyers that the JWs are handing out right now.
I should imagine that the publicity campaign is serving three purposes. Firstly, to advertise the convention, secondly, to push the JWorg website (the biggest confection of propoganda and doublespeak ever created!) and lastly to elevate the GB by having the face of one of them on the flyer.
Personally, I’m glad that it’s Good ‘Ole Tony that they’ve chosen. The whole GB are a PR nightmare. But Tony is the very best at rambling off on a tangent and telling the crowd just what an ignorant, cruel, chauvinistic, lying and uncivilised man he really is.
I’m hoping someone records his train wreck of a talk, so that we can use it as ammunition in our battle to curtail these stupid and cruel GB members’ complete power over eight million people.
Peace be with you
I came here seeking truth. I didn’t find it.
To echo Pilate’s question, what is truth?
Do your own research and find your own truth. All you need to know is on the internet or within WTBTS publications.
I hope you find what you are looking for.
Peace be with you
Thank you. I think I already have. But not here. I pity you. Your minds and hearts so bitter and twisted. It’s very sad.
And what have you discovered in your research, Joe Blogs? You are correct about bitter minds and hearts; at least regarding any believing JWs who post here. Anyone whose central and ruling obsession is looking forward to this fantasy Armageddon and the execution of the bulk of humanity has to eaten up with bitterness.
So now you make THIS your mission in life…?!? You have NOTHING to offer. I’m done here. I’ve seen enough. I won’t be returning to read your vengeful, bullying taunts. Therefore no need to respond. However, I have a feeling that your ego’s won’t let that happen. Oh I probably forgot to mention that I’m an ex JW.
Do you want a medal for still being indoctrinated as an Ex-JW? Join the queue.
Thank you for your offering, Joe Blogs, of your inchoate anger.
You have specified nothing that has caused your ire, merely flung out some random insults.
If anyone knew what has upset you on this site, some sort of dialogue might begin.
As it is we know nothing beyond the fact that Joe Blogs is incapable of explaining himself.
Where are my “vengeful, bullying taunts” on this site?
How is being concerned for the welfare of children and young people an example of “minds and hearts so bitter and twisted”?
I wish you well in your journey of seeking the truth. I don’t think you will find it easy if all you ever do is insult people who are trying to protect children from the disgusting paedophiles that the WTBTS protects and shelters, do you?
Peace be with you
After hearing Morris iii speak It reminded me of things I heard spoken as I was growing up , going to the conventions , assemblies and KH’s . I could not STOP laughing as to what I hearing . I have heard talks about the smurf’s , demons and so on , but this has got to be serious that the GB have dementia ?
You had to mention socks, didn’t you?
I am one of Jehovah’s Witnesses and it saddens me to see apostates like you shaming Jehovah and his organization. Just because you have fallen out of the truth or have been disfellowshipped or hurt by a Brother or Sister doesn’t mean you should go and start a blog full of falsities and misinterpretations. Show some humility. Because a true christian like you would listen to counsel from the Elders or The Governing Body. I truly hope all of you apostates stop being influenced by Satan and start acting like Godly men, not those who tickle the ears of others and try to stumble others because of their wrongdoing.
Please, Ryan, list the falsehoods that you have read on this blog.
I was raised as a Jehovah’s Witness. I was told that Armageddon was definitely due before the end of the 20th century.
This was presented to me as God given absolute TRUTH.
If anyone should be in the dock for peddling falsehoods it is the Watchtower Society.
Hello Ryan, welcome to JWsurvey. I take it the only people on earth who don’t need to “show some humility” are your revered seven blokes in New York who can’t seem to help themselves from thrusting their faces on our TV screens and computer monitors at every opportunity. How convenient for them! Can you name me an oppressive, authoritarian regime in history where it hasn’t worked to the advantage of the leaders for all opponents to be silenced (and framed as proud, troublesome, divisive) while they get a carte blanche to do whatever they like?
Ryan, I became one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in 1965 and baptized in 1966 so I know of what I am speaking of. Also, most of my immediate family are still strong in the “truth”.
Last year by accident, I started researching the history of the Society and I was quite shocked at what had been purposely kept from all the rest of us.
All the claims of divine authority from God goes back to the history around 1914-1919 and those claims need to be authenticated. If you can’t authenticate those claims, then all the claims fall into lies.
You need to find out if the Society is actually run by God or not. If not, then you are supporting lies and are in a cult. Don’t waste 50 years of your life supporting lies like I did and so many others did. Before you know it, you will be old and you won’t die at Armageddon, but you will die of old age, waiting for Armageddon.
The internet must have a thousand people who are going on with Youtube videos, exposing the history and the lies. Don’t be afraid to look at them and look up all the articles from old magazines and books to prove it. Don’t take “apostates”word for what they are pointing out to you. Also, don’t be afraid to test out the “truth”. If it’s really the “truth”, it will stand up to lies.
Ryan, I wanted to add to my last comment to you.
When I think about the people at my Kingdom Hall, I think most of them fit the category of a sociopath or a narcissist and I will explain why and why it’s not a good thing.
Most sociopaths are narcissistic and a malevolent narcissist is cruel and unfeeling and egocentric (love of self).
Jehovah’s Witnesses are taught to be egocentric in that they are taught to be proud of being one of Jehovah’s Witnesses. On the outside, that doesn’t seem to be a bad thing to be proud of being a worshipper of God but what it does to Jehovah’s Witnesses is to make them proud of themselves as a group. They believe that only they know the Bible and claim to be the only group that God recognizes as the “truth”. It makes them arrogant.
Most sociopaths or narcissists aren’t born that way. They become that way. People aren’t born to hate people of another race or culture but they are taught to hate other people or classes and no amount of reasoning with these people can convince them otherwise that they could be wrong in their assumptions.
Jehovah’s Witnesses are taught that they alone have the “truth” and they are trained that way from birth that all other people besides Jehovah’s Witnesses, God hates and is going to destroy them at Armageddon because anyone not of their religion is wicked and deserving of death if they don’t convert to their religion. They are trained not to be humble but arrogant and to hate anyone who is not one of Jehovah’s Witnesses as “wicked”.
When Jehovah’s Witnesses leave the religion, they see that other people that are not Jehovah’s Witnesses are not the “wicked” that they had been taught to believe after all, so that learned behavior and thinking can be “untrained” to love other people of other religions and cultures again and not to look at all others as wicked. That former way of looking at other people who aren’t of their religion was paranoid and not normal.
It’s much the same as it was in Germany during Hitler’s reign. Those Germans were trained to look at the Jews as vermin, deserving of death and carried out Hitler’s orders, murdering millions of innocent people, thinking they were obeying God because they thought Hitler was speaking for God and that God supposedly hated the Jews and wanted them exterminated.
Jehovah’s Witnesses are under that same kind of cult control of the Watchtower, just the same as the Germans were under the control of Hitler. Being “controlled” as they are, the Watchtower can tell them anything and the Witnesses will do what they are being told, no matter how bad it may seem to a normal person. They blindly believe that the Watchtower leaders are speaking for God with zero evidence that God is backing them.
In order to obey someone who claims to be speaking for God, there needs to be evidence, not blind obedience. Otherwise, if you carry out their orders, you could be blood guilty for misrepresenting God. If you don’t want to be blood guilty, you need to examine the claims of those people that you follow to make sure that they are telling you the truth and nothing but the truth and not making false claims. Truth will stand up to lies. If not, you could be under the demonic control of a cult and not even know it.
(I went back into some older posts and I saw that I stole the name Willows from somebody else so I am trying to find a moniker that nobody else has used yet)
Ryan, cults use fear to keep people inside the cult and being a Witness, we are taught a slew of irrational fears. In the Rutherford’s day, Witnesses were taught to fear aluminum, vaccinations and holidays and “worldly people”. Witnesses were erroneously told that they were to stay away from vaccinations because there was supposed to be blood in vaccinations. Many people died because of this teaching. They were even taught to fear and distrust the American Medical Association and look at them as quacks so people were afraid to go to the doctor in those days. Today, we are taught to be afraid of everything and everyone not in the Watchtower, such as holidays, holiday songs, all people who are not in the “truth”, entertainment and each other in the congregation. Jehovah’s Witnesses are not to associate with anyone who doesn’t live up to certain standards, such as: Are they baptized? How do they dress? How many hours do they get in service? Do they have the pioneer spirit? Do they gossip? How do they dress? Are they on the Ministry School? What do they do for entertainment? Do they answer at meetings? What is their language like?
It’s all about: Are they good enough for ME????? In other words, Jehovah’s Witnesses are very arrogant and judge everybody else whether they are good association by how “spiritual” they think others are in comparison to themselves. I remember seeing this kind of paranoid judging of each other in all the Kingdom Ministries.
That is why kids get baptized at such early ages. They want friends and the only friends they are allowed to have are other Witness kids and Witness kids are taught that they can’t hang around with anybody who isn’t good association and that means they have to be really good in the “truth”, so to speak with all the above attributes.
This religion is sick and it teaches all it’s members that sick kind of judging each other and promotes narcissism. Narcissism is a mental disease.
Ryan, I wanted to add to my last comment to you. I know what I am talking about because I have been associated and baptized since 1966.
At least half of my congregation are on anti-depressants or addicted to prescription pain pills.
This religion called Jehovah’s Witnesses produces people who are either self-righteous and egotistical or depressed, stressed and lonely, none of which is normal and healthy. Is it any wonder that it has the lowest retention rate of all other religions?
Since I stopped going to meetings, my mental health has improved greatly, even though I have lost all the so-called fake friends I had at the hall. I pity all those people still going to any meetings in any Kingdom Hall, because I know in my heart that all that love and acceptance that they feel now is only if they continue on that treadmill of trying to measure up and they know it. They know in their hearts that the love is conditional but they are so afraid of being alone that they keep up the pretense.
No religion could be from God if that is the kind of love it produces.
I dare not judge the state of mind of every member and make hasty assumptions. Where is your proof of all these mentally ill JW members? I understand your anger but beware of your argument it sounds weak. Yes members are confused but the only way to change the structure is by promoting reason. It is easy to attach Satan to anything the GB wants but if you reason it with believers with truth it can help create change. If I decide to return my game plan is to change it for the better. I have no problem contacting police and removing bad individuals. I would have to gain status again but this is easy since I know the game. Play nice then play hard. Jehovah wants me to purge this vile organization from its dark path. I feel both Jesus and Jehovah guiding me back to change it from misunderstandings to truth. I will see what happens but I cannot stand to the side and watch this is WAR.
We already have a Rosie!!! She’s a lovely lady from Ireland!
I don’t know what was wrong with anonymous! We all knew it was you, dear lady, by your distinctive prose.
Why don’t you try a Latin route word like my pseudonym?
Peace be with you,
Welcome to JW Survey!
Can you explain how I am “shaming Jehovah”?
I have just written to my MP to inform him of the child protection policy of the WTBTS. Are you aware of the child protection policy, Ryan? What do you think about it?
I urge you to do your independent research. I exhort you to help us to bring justice to the many victims of child abuse in your religion.
Peace be with you,
Hi Excelsior. Okay, I will go back to anonymous. I thought maybe it was too generic so I was racking my brain, trying to come up with another name that nobody else was using. So, I will go back to just anonymous.
@Magusknight1974. I don’t know if you were asking for proof of the mentally ill in my congregation but I know them very well and I am confident of what I am speaking about in that at least half are on anti-depressants or prescription pain pills or depressed, stressed or arrogant. It’s one or the other. I did not take a poll though so it’s just a guess.
As far as saying that JW’s as a group are taught to be proud, I know that is a fact. All of Jehovah’s Witnesses are taught to be proud of their religion from youth in school till the day they die. Are you one of Jehovah’s Witnesses? Tell me that isn’t true and I can find you article after article refuting that claim. Being taught to be proud is not a good thing, even if it’s being proud because of your religion. It teaches you to think you are better than the rest of the world because God is speaking through your leaders, which is no different than any other cult. Cult think is what makes people commit crimes of killing other people, when normally if they were left on their own, would never do such a thing. Cult think is what makes people shun close friends and family for no reason at all, except that a person doesn’t want to be associated with the Witnesses and all the lies anymore. That cult think causes many suicides. It is cruel and to treat loved ones like that is not normal. I do not take it back what I said. I believe that all of Jehovah’s Witnesses are taught to be not normal. That doesn’t mean that I have any hatred for them. I was in that cult think for 50 years myself. How could I hate them? It’s the Organization I hold responsible for that. I’d never hate any of Jehovah’s Witnesses for being held hostage by that religion. I understand that mind control because it held me hostage all these years too.
@magusknight1974 and Ryan. I don’t know if you two are still on here, but I remember when I was new in the “truth”, I’d look up every scripture in every meeting part and I remember being so disgusted with the rest of congregation when you could tell the rest of the congregation didn’t look up those scriptures with their answers during meetings and thinking to myself how terrible they were for being so “lazy” about it.
I remember one time when a young sister whose husband was giving the Sunday talk and she commented during the Watchtower that Jehovah rejected Cain’s sacrifice because it wasn’t an animal and I raised my hand and corrected her. I am so ashamed of how arrogant I was.
I believe that the more people go out in service and the more they obey in every respect what the Society expects of us, the more big-headed and arrogant they become and the more they look down on the rest of the flock who they then consider “lazy” because I can remember being like that. I have believed that for years and that is one of the biggest reason why I would never sign up for regular pioneering.
A few weeks ago during the Watchtower study, my husband came home and told me about some illustrations about a young fellow who thought about dating a fellow employee and my husband was telling me about all the comments from different ones in the congregation, referring to all “worldly” people like they were nothing but scum.
In this religion, you have to believe everything the Society says and if not, you will be called on the carpet for the least little comment. One time, I commented in front of one of my children that I didn’t believe that the entire Bible was inspired and my daughter made me promise to “confess” my sin to the elders. Another time I said something like that to my husband and he told on me to the elders for saying that. Nobody should be afraid to make a comment like that and then be threatened with being kicked out and shunned. Any religion that has that kind of control over people, isn’t normal and is a cult.
Hi there Everyone – Rosie here!
I haven’t commented for a while, but I have been catching up daily with Cedars site and truly value reading everyone’s comments and experiences here in our ex-JW community, knowing that our suffering due to the JW Org brings us together.
To Rosieinthewoods (formerly Willow, Willows, anonymous), coincidentally my moniker to begin with was Rosieinthegarden!
As my friend Excelsior said, we could tell exactly who the real Anonymous was, so don’t worry about someone else commenting under your Anonymous name.
I think you are a wonderful and amazing lady to have the courage to turn away from the Org after so many devout years. I love reading your comments – especially those in reply to the JWapologists. They are so logical that I do not know how any active JW who reads them cannot begin to question their beliefs. I have noted a few down so that if ever the opportunity should arise I will use some of your points to put to my JW family.
I do agree with you about the narcissistic element of the Org. JWs believe that they are superior to everyone else who is not a JW – believing they deserve to live while all others perish. How arrogant!
However I think that while Narcissists feature prominantly in the Org, so too do their codependents – those who cannot think for themselves and who rely on the Narcissists to tell them how to think, and in turn the Narcissists feed off the adulation from these ones.
Narcissists don’t want their superiority challenged and thrive on control and power, whereas Codependents will avoid confrontation and so remain subservient to them.
Unfortunately the codependents feel the need to defend the behaviour of the narcissist which results in codependent behaviour characterised by dishonesty and denial.
I know of a Sister (not very well off) who was assigned along with her husband to carry out hours and hours of unpaid (skilled) labour doing renovating work at the London Bethel. When challenged that she and her husband were being taken advantage of, she replied reverently that it was a privilege and honour to be asked!!
The codependents are afraid to question or leave the Org because they lack self-esteem and self-respect, feeling unable to cope without being controlled – needing the Elders and the GB to tell them how to think, what to wear, who to talk to etc, and believing there is nothing else outside of the Org for them.
The narcissitic GB plays on this and adds the fear of being alone through being shunned by family and former friends as a threat to prevent these ones from leaving.
I am so happy that more and more ones are starting to see through this and break free from this Cults terrible mind-control. As you said in a previous comment – the Org does not just need it’s policies changed – it needs totally exposed for the fraud that it is!
Hi Rosie. It is good to hear from you too. It is so nice to be able to comment here and glad to hear anonymous is okay to use. I get off my chest all the things I wish I could say to my family but they won’t listen to me so I am always trying to reason with them in my mind and since they won’t listen to me, hopefully somebody else will listen to my way of thinking and understand what I am trying to say, so thank you for the encouragement.
I have been listening to a lot of Youtube videos about narcissism and sociopaths lately and how they control religions and I know exactly what you are talking about. One good thing I found out because I worried if I was a narcissist or a sociopath and they mostly said if you ask, then you aren’t one because sociopaths and narcissists couldn’t care less.
It also amazes me too how people can do all the free work for the Society and then consider it a “privilege” and then if that isn’t bazaar enough, the Society has “rules” on if a person is good enough to do the free work yet. I was listening to some of the talks for that branch visit and I think it was Herd who went on and on and on and on about Bethelites being late for work. It’s like “Dude” these people are unpaid slaves. What more do you want????
How well I know the frustration of trying to talk to your family – in my case even about non-JW things. They miss no opportunity in making cutting remarks to me or to bring in references to the Org. In fact it has at times caused me such stress and emotional upset after having contact with them that I wonder why I bother. Maybe because I love them?
Many of my family, particularly the older generation are there because it is a lovely little social club for them, also a means of keeping control over their family, not to mention an excuse to blame anything that goes wrong on Satan. These ones are aware of things that aren’t right about the Org, but don’t want to know as they don’t want anything to upset their lovely little worlds.
I have often likened their attitude to someone who likes wearing a particular style of clothing made by a fashion house, who to the public face presents a wholesome and pleasing front, but behind the closed doors of their factory employ cruel and abusive methods to their unpaid workers. (relate this to the sexual abuse, shunning, suicides etc that goes on in the Org)
When whistleblowers present evidence as to what is going on behind the scenes, those wearing the clothing who have a conscience, must surely be horrified and refuse to continue wearing the clothes and thus supporting the people perpetrating the cruel practices.
If they know and still refuse to stop buying the clothes and turn a blind eye and deaf ear to what is going on, then this is a poor reflection on them and in my mind makes them as guilty as the ones carrying out the abuse.
I know exactly what you are saying. There are so many heart wrenching videos on Youtube about people who were sexually abused when they were young and how the elders and the Society didn’t do anything to help them but instead sent them back to the ones who were abusing them and treated them as the abusers instead.
These videos go back over 10 years and they are from every part of the world. I don’t know how anybody can watch even one of these videos and not despise everything the Society stands for but I can’t even get my husband to watch even one. Witnesses close their eyes and refuse to see how sinister the organization is and it makes me so angry as I can remember all those ugly comments my husband made about the Catholic church and how “stupid” those people were to stick with the Catholic Church after all the child abuse scandals were brought out into the open. He is such a hypocrite and so are all of Jehovah’s Witnesses.
That is why they prefer not to know. They want to stay in that bubble because they know full well what would happen if they admitted that the Society protects child molesters. They would have to disassociate themselves from this Satanic cult and face the rest of their lives alone without a friend in the world and come to the realization that their whole life was wasted on a fantasy.
The Society is evil. There is no other word to describe them.
Bon Chance, sir, on your quest to change a high control cult from the inside. It’s going to test your mettle to the limit.
I would urge you to consider the consequences. To reach a sufficiently high level in this cult, you will be tested by being forced to do things that are against your conscience. For example, you could be the bully boy who intimidates witnesses of abuse and threatens them with disfellowshipping if they tell others about the abuser, or go to the police. This is the kind of test that you will have to successfully pass in order to progress up the hierarchy. They will not let you anywhere near a policy changing status before you have done some truly repugnant things.
I’m not trying to put you off, but you do need to know that your goal is not an easy one for a man with a Christian conscience.
Be assured that we all want to help you if we can.
Peace be with you,
Welcome back to your original monicker, dear lady. I echo Rosie’s opinion – your comments are always worth the read, and offer a unique insight into how women are really viewed in the WTBTS. Your dignity and compassion are evident to us all.
As you know, my Dear Old Mum is never going to be able to leave this cult. It would cause her deep spiritual pain, and I have reached a successful truce with her over her continued involvement in a religion steeped in crime and cover ups. She really believes that God will put these things right. I agreed with her. We want the same things, but seen from a different point of view. The narrative is that God and Jesus can use anyone they wish to effect change. The apostates are now doing the will of God, and my Dear Old Mum can still continue to go to her meetings and have the comfort of her beliefs. It works for us. I know it’s bonkers, but there, in a nutshell, is the craziness of the human condition.
I know that dealing with your relatives is nowhere near as easy for you as for me. I guess we’ve just got to keep on loving our families as our hearts tell us and believe that, with time, love and compassion will overcome these barriers. In the meantime, you have the real sympathy of this old atheist, as do all those who are suffering under the cruel yoke of shunning.
Ladies, you are a shining light and I salute you both for your compassion and humanity. You have both suffered and yet neither of you are bitter. You still show love to those who have wronged you. That, in my opinion, makes you two of the best human beings and women I know.
Peace be with you,
Thank you Excelsior! for the nice compliment. I can’t even begin to say how much I appreciate Lloyd’s starting this web site. Once a person “wakes” up and realizes how evil the roots of JW religion really is and you can’t tell anybody about it, it about kills you. At least this way, may be some who are curious will click on it and see from our personal experiences that we are telling the real truth about the Society and either come out altogether or not get involved in the first place. It makes me very hopeful.
I see that Lloyd’s thoughts about the JW tv thing on Youtube is almost up to 40,000 views. Those can’t all be ex-witnesses who clicked on it. There might be a lot of people who tune it in by accident but if they give it a few minutes and listen to him and see how really “normal” and funny he is, will realize that we aren’t all demons with horns coming out of our heads after all and give it a listen and then maybe come to this web site and hopefully see that we are out to help them, not hurt them, like the Society would like them to think.
Thanks Excelsior. You are very kind. Your friendship and continued support mean a lot. I admire all the work you are doing to bring WT’s abusive policies to the attention of the authorities.
I wholeheartedly endorse Anonymous’s sentiment – this web site provides a place where we can all find comfort and support and offers enlightenment about the truth behind the Org in abundance; that even amazes those of us who have been awake for many years.
Life outside of the Org can be a very happy and fulfilled life, but it is very easy to feel depressed over what the WT has stolen from us, and I know how hard it is especially for those who have recently made the break.
So thank you again to Cedars for providing this site.
One day, some of the people in my congregation will wonder why i left. My parents will wonder why i left.
This is one of the reasons why.
I used to rationalise that maybe Jehovah just doesn’t like people doing non heteronormative things, i mean, i didn’t ask to be gay.
But nope. Why would i stay in a place that is disgusted with my existence?
Funny he’s wearing a purple tie!
Shunning makes absolutely no sense to me. As a hypothetical example, say there is a family, a practicing mother, a non-believing father, and 4 children, 2 girls and 2 boys. Daughter #1 is a devout witness. Daughter #2 WAS a devout witness, baptized at 12 years old, vacation pioneered in early teen years, then became disillusioned and started questioning the religion, and was disfellowshipped. Son #1, never expressed much interest in the “truth” and was never baptized, and faded away. He subsequently married and is following his wife’s religion, Catholic. Son #2, also did not express interest, faded away, became openly gay.
In this example, ONLY daughter #2 would be shunned. Mother and daughter #1 could openly associate with son #1 and son #2, but definitely not daughter #2. What the hell did daughter #2 do that was so bad? Questioning things that do not make sense?
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