Oftentimes, when speaking to friends and acquaintances I am asked, “Why? Why do you care what the Witnesses do? Why do you bother writing articles or helping the ex-JW movement? Why not just move on and forget it all?”
I’m sure some of you reading this have similar questions.
To the casual observer, the Jehovah’s Witnesses are at best a group of nice people, and at worst a bunch of interrupting doorknockers with a doomsday message. The average person would not classify Watchtower as harmful. However, that’s simply not the case. And this is why I speak out.
I speak out because families are being torn apart by Watchtower’s cruel and unjust shunning policy
A person who decides to leave the organization must do so knowing they will lose friends and even blood relatives due to the Watchtower policy on avoiding those who reject their teachings. I personally have a sister I haven’t seen in thirteen years. We grew up inseparably, and now we are strangers. She has never met my daughter, and unless she too decides to leave, I will never meet her children.
My parents are lost to Watchtower’s demands, and I honestly have no hope of recovering that relationship. I am being shunned. It’s not fair and it hurts. So, I speak out.
I speak out because women and children are being held as victims by the misogynistic teachings at the Kingdom Hall
Pedophilia and domestic violence are swept under the rug at an alarming rate all across the world. The men in charge would rather keep the Watchtower brand name clean than admit a problem with abuse, and change policies that hurt vulnerable ones.
Unless there are two witnesses to the act, a child who is molested has no hope of recourse if the accused abuser denies his or her claim.
A woman who is beaten by her husband cannot leave him and remain in good standing within the organization. The only counsel given is for her to “be a better wife.”
I was that wife. I know how it feels. So, I speak out.
I speak out because countless innocent people have lost their lives because of a skewed interpretation of a biblical verse on eating blood
People are literally dying by refusing blood transfusions.
The lives of countless men, women, children, and even babies are seen as less important than following the edicts of the governing body. I hate seeing this senseless loss of life. It hurts me to see these victims of foolishness be lost. So, I speak out.
I speak out because children and young people, many of whom know no other way of life, are being denied access to a quality education
Homeschooling among Witnesses is encouraged—essentially cutting children off from the outside world. They are told that college and university learning is sinful, that reading anything outside of the information Watchtower provides is a path to destruction, that making an informed decision by looking at all sources on a topic could make you guilty of a crime known as apostasy.
I was the child who was too afraid to ask questions. As an adult, I can see how many opportunities I’ve missed in life by not pursuing education. I struggle now trying to complete a degree and raise a child at the same time. So, I speak out.
I speak out for those still inside who are suffering.
I speak out for those who have been lost or who have lost ones to these policies.
I speak out for those too weak to share their stories.
I speak out to show support to others who are trying to help.
I speak out to inform the public and hopefully keep more people from being hurt.
Any of you still in ever counted how many in your kh actually came in from contact in FS ? we have around 120 regulars I counted 10 . Now mainly born ins even the 80yr olds. So how do you break old culture and endless years of indoctrination. It’s going to take a miracle and maybe that will happen. Anyone noticed now that you/me are fully awake how nasty some of them are? I would venture to say it is a clash of spirits! Certainly not very Christlike. I find I actually listen to what people really say and actually some of those stupid sheep condemn themselves out of their own mouths. It is quite interesting. So my conclusion is that every one who reads this website should out even just one comment ,a truthful statement of how they have been wounded it would make most interesting reading. Thanks all ruthless/ruthlee
All I can say is Thank You Thank You Thank You. I am shunned by my entire immediate family . 5 years I have not seen mother, father, brother, niece and nephew. Please never stop speaking out! You are saving lives lost to depression, anger and fear.
por estos casos debe seguir este trabajo de boca en boca el CUERPO GOBERNANTE debe eliminar la expulsion de su doctrina por el bien de humanos que confian en ellos
debe comprenderse que no es contra los feligreses el reclamo
SEPARAR a la gente de estos cabecillas sedientos de dinero poder y esclavos llenos de miedo
JAMAS ir de punta con tjs son nuestros familiares hermanos hijos padres ellos solo deben recibir nuestro amor asi sea el silencio los RESPONSABLES son la WACHTOWER INC.
CUERPO GOBERNANTE SOLICITAMOS LA LIBERACION DE LOS 8.000.000 DE REHENES!
Agatha, Exactamente, no me gusta lo JW org Hace a la gente. ME GUSTARIA Que pudieran Ser Detenidos. Se llevan la felicidad emocional. Queremos estar emocionalmente bien. Toman esa habilidad de distancia.
Debbie Smith, I’m now going through shunning to. We speak out because we don’t like to see anyone struggle. I speak up because I want people to have peace of mind in their lives.
Keep doing good work. You help people to open eyes.
Thank you for all your efforts, your time and your contribution! I would love to help you if I only can.
Once again thank you very much.
Kaz.
It seems my fiancé will be inheriting a small house in Chicago, il. We will be setting up shop there. I know that some of the most powerful ex-jw communities come from that part of the globe. I hope I can get in touch with them. I have so many ideas I want to start using to spread the truth about this cult.
I found stickeryou and vistaprint which can help me make stickers that people can place on their front doors to ward off JW’s and direct them to jwfacts and this site for WT truths. I would need people willing to help me hand these out instructing people on the benefits of placing these right where witnesses can see them. I visited the local assembly hall in Romeoville,Il once and it has just one road that leads to it. I will be looking into the cost of placing a large sign warning people of this cults practices. Pedophilia, Shunning, twisting of scripture, numerous failed and false prophecies etc….
I really hope others around the planet can find it in themselves to help rescue these poor spiritual hostages from this dangerous doomsday cult by picking up on their ex-jw activism. Don’t just move on, not yet, lets all donate a bit of our time before moving on to this very important cause.
As you know I still attend some meeting because of family tie within the cult. I do however spend lots of time in ‘the field’ warning others and referring them to this and other sites. I have just had my ‘encouraging’ visit and the left the interrogation till the end. yes I admitted to going to my sons wedding – he is df’d. I told them my conscience was clear before God. They seemed taken aback so now I guess i wait on what comes next. I will continue to speak out although it is carefully.
@Tara
The following article contains useful information on the options for exiting the WT cult (disassociation, fading or disappearing). It provides suggestions on how to develop a successful exit strategy (fading or disappearing) if you are looking to avoid being disfellowshipped or announced as disassociated. It provides suggestions to help you plan your exit steps cautiously and carefully in the way that best fits your individual circumstances given that all of the exit strategies have their advantages and disadvantages:
https://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/wiki/index#wiki_exit_guide
Scroll down to see the EXIT GUIDE.
Hope it helps.
Thanks Dee. That is interesting and useful. I’m a pretty good actor…. or so I have been told…. lol.
Being ‘wise’ to them also helps you to see through their methods of lulling you into a false sense of security…. I was fore armed knowing this so when they brought out the big guns I was ready with counter attack…. Using the conscience card threw them. they couldn’t argue with it…. maybe they will go away and regroup or maybe they will sit back and watch. This site is helping me so much to build up confidence so that I can thwart their tactics. :)
Yes, you definitely did the right thing, going to your son’s wedding. A wedding is something that does not come along very often. You will forever have this happy memory to treasure. And why wouldn’t your conscience be clear before God anyway? Believe me, your conscience would have been disturbed if you had not gone, Tara.
Hi Tara. I am glad you went to your sons wedding. Who is the WT to tell us what and what we cannot do in regard to our personal decisions and especially in regard to our families? The wt likes to mention about “CONSCIENCE” matters when it comes to the JW’s taking blood particles, sitting on a jury,Evn supposedely VOTING? Rememebr about 10 years or more ago they came out with some ridiculous WT article saying they do not forbid JW”s from voting? They said if you go into a voting booth and shut the current nobody knows who or what you did in there? you may or may not have noted n even tried to say it was up to your conscience? I am sure they were saying that to cover themselves against any government claims that they are not good citizens etc.or trying to say JW’s are against the political system. So if they can claim things are against THEIR conscience why not us or them? The WT tries to control every movement and thoughts and freedom of thinking of their members.It is none of the WT darn business if we attend any wedding or funeral or other event if we choose. Good for you Tara and remember they are only men pretending to be holier than thou and pretending to be spokes persons for Almighty God and we know that is not true.
Keep telling them you feel it is a conscience matter the same as if a JW decides to do replacement work fop not serving in the military. At one time a JW could not do that but now they can I guess Jehovah changed his mind again? All the Best Tara.
Thank you for that Dee…I know it wasnt aimed at me but I found it so helpful…I am in a similair position to Tara so need this sort of specific advice…Thank You
Idontknowhatodo:
I’m glad you found the info in the Exit Guide to be helpful.
It seems to me that if one should choose the fading route to exit the JW cult, then they will have to be prepared to play the fading game as those elders will certainly come a calling as they must rescue the spiritually weak and inactive.
I also note that there has been some useful comments on this site about how to play the fading game.
All the best in planning your exit strategy :).
Tara,Good for you for going to your son’s wedding. The fact you went to the wedding shows you are acting in an emotionally healthy way. This article why speak out gives the reasons why speaking out is an emotionally healthy thing to do. Jws aren’t emotionally healthy. Any parent who turns their back on their offspring isn’t going to be a ballanced, emotionally happy person. Good for you.
Thanks Catalina :) I totally believe it is wrong to try and come between a mother and her children… I think even the Bible mentions something about a child and it’s mother and the link…. can’t quite recall where I read it. My children and my grandchildren are my life. (and the cats…and I guess the kids dogs….)
Tara
Don’t let those elders turn you against your son. I’m sure if you should be in need it won’t be those elders who will come running to assist you.
Life is short. Never let anyone come in between you and your family. Always treasure your family no matter what so that at the end of the day you will have no regrets.
My son and I have a growing relationship now. He told me he is proud of me for learning to stand up against the Borg. He and his lovely wife are backing me up as are her parents and their friends… it’s quite humbling really.
Tara. I ti s quite amazing that we as former JW’s all remember that we made our Non JW families feel bad when we did not participate with them in family events, holidays, weddings, funerals,now that we are fading the families accept us back into the human fold but the JW’s won’t accept us and they claim to have “LOVE AMONG THEMSELVES”? They actually do not have that love but they have a very very conditional association with each other. That is the truth of the matter. A while back my Mother died and my JW ife did not want to attend the funeral bc it was in a churcH? I was also a JW and I got upset bc I loved my mother and she said she would help at the wake and cook food etc.I blew up and she eventually did attend the funeral but acted like she was scared of “DEMONS” bc it was a Catholic Church! The Jw’s are a Crazy religion! Dooms day cult is what they are.
God Bless you Tara for having the courage to speak the truth. Your explanation to them with a clear consience really brightened up my day.
It’s all thanks to everyone on here and a quick prayer for courage.
Maybe that is a lesson for all. Pray for courage. A very wise move Tara.
ery so with you. I have been attending the new lenox congregation for 2+ years now. As of today im wondering if I should leave after looking at testimonials On YouTube and now here. The reason why I wanna quit is simply I see to much undercover stuff going on and me coming from “the world” I noticed for years that if you don’t spiritualy progress that they don’t want to talk to me or avoid me. Totally doing the opposite of what the bible teaches. Simply put I call it being fake. Acting like your better than me because I see the real person you are and need a bible to act like a friendly person. I see a lot in the congregation have their own “click” so to speak and if your from the other side of the tracks “poor” and not middle class that I’m looked appon like scum. And I also hear about people in these car groups talking bad about other’s in the congregation. I thought jw wasn’t supposed to think like the world…haha hypocrites today me. At the romeoville conventions also I notice a lot of women who dress in very short skirts and very high heels like they are about to go too a club. I’m so ready to leave because this experience as of late is very depressing which I suffer from. But everyone is too busy with their own lives and own thoughts of me to even care or possibly just don’t care in general because of being so self centered I realize also that I’m really the only one who talks with this Hispanic gentlemen who looks mentally handicap and not the baptized ones who have been whiteness for years . Yeah it’s that bad.
Michael Green, it’s always moving to a new congo that the stark reminder hits you that you have walked into yet another problematic congregation. In the time my husband and I were in the Watchtower we changed congregations many times. You know what, they were all pretty much the same. Well, same but different. Kind of evil. This sounds typically like most congregations that I can remember. Coming out of the world and shedding all your material possessions to “better serve Jehovah” caused us to be looked down upon by others who were more materially wealthy. I think it is a very good time to pack your bags and go. You might even be able to go before they send their letter about you to the new elders. That is what I think anyway. Might be the time now to reconnect with your real family too. All the best with your decision.
Good on you for speaking out. All of us who were in the cult should speak out and reveal the truth about it. The JWs present a very benign image to the world, carefully hiding the high control, social isolation and emotional blackmail that underpins their cult. Until it is too late. Few people know about that reality. Instead they think the JWs are an odd Christian sect with nice, polite people who dress conservatively, don’t celebrate birthdays and other celebrations, don’t stand up for the national anthem and refuse blood transfusions. And that’s about the extent of it, which isn’t nearly enough warning.
We need to speak up to prevent others from falling victim to the initial nice message of life everlasting and all the love-bombing that fools people into wasting their lives and destroying real, unconditional relationships. Eleven years of my childhood was robbed from me, my parent’s marriage was destroyed and my mother is a stranger to all of us as she has wasted 45 years of her 87 years in that cult. She will die in the cult. I remember her before she joined and dragged us into it. A light, happy woman transformed into a harsh and joyless authoritarian. There are millions of us who have suffered in such a way, and many have endured far worse damage, even suicide.
Any time the subject of JWs comes up, I always state firmly that it is a cult that needs to be avoided like the plague. When I’m asked why, I tell them, careful to not sound spiteful or angry. Just the facts – the facts that few know about. Everybody is always shocked by the reality. So if that helps someone out there avoid getting sucked into that miserable existence, good!
@M Saurus
You mentioned that you, your husband and grown son left and that your husband and yourself were in since early childhood.
Do you or your husband have family members remaining in the cult given that you were both in it from early childhood?
You didn’t mention what caused you and your husband to wake up and leave. Just wondering, what was it that opened your eyes and made you both decide to leave?
Jeni, I wanted to add my thank you and tell you how grateful I am to you and all the rest of you who take their time to warn people about the Watchtower abuses. If it wasn’t for all of you who go through the work of exposing Watchtower, I don’t know where I’d be right now. It’s all your work is what is keeping me going and not drowning in my own despair. Thank you all so much!!
I just listened to the latest jwpodcast and I wanted to say how much I will miss James but hope for the best for him and also think him for all that he has done.
For those of us, that haven’t been completely ratted out or discovered, if you ever saw the movie” invasion of the body snatchers”, think of that moment when it’s discovered that your still human and everyone points and screams, that’s kinda of the general feeling when your still on the inside waiting for the shoe to drop.
However, it does feel like there’s a growing internal disconnect between our teaching and the believe that their right. More and more, it seems the r&f are giving less and less attention to the constantly changing doctrine, not even attempting to grasp the implications of any changes, on one hand I find that fascinating and on the other it seems discouraging, mise well just elect a Pope and be done with it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=My6fQtJP9f8
Short scene from “A Perfect World”. Yup.
I had completely forgotten about this movie. Looking it up, thanks.
William Draper, I left about the year 2000 , was in from 1975 to 2000 , disfellow shipped 2 times with just cause , such helped me to be stronger , and more disciplined . I left though , because numerous things just don’t stand scrutiny . The religion just isn’t faithful to scripture , brainwashes people to love the pronunciation of what they refer to as God’s name but it really is not . They are just stuck in tradition , no 7th Day Sabbath , will consider any person APOSTATE no matter how they are living , if they DARE to remain steadfast in understanding things a little bit differently . I am about as close to still being a JW as a person can be , but not .
I protest against quite a few things which r not scriptural , shunning in many instances is scriptural , but not as much as they make it . Just the writing of my book supporting the 7th Day Sabbath makes me an APOSTATE in the eyes of jws , where in scripture can such be found . my sister a JW doesn’t visit her mother except for a few hours every 4 years , same for her grand-daughter, every 8 yrs , and she has never been a JW , and mostly only mildly opposed .
After losing my children to being adopted (actually my exwife losing them) to the babysitter 1000 miles away from where we lived. Wiley . The jw elders actually supported her keeping children away from me because as they said , it is what her attorney said would be best for her to get full custody .
9 months she and her new husband lost the children due to neglect and abuse reported on by the babysitter in Indiana .
850- 532- 5053
What I meant to mention is the great love that exist among the new, devastated from divorce and ex wife losing children to babysitter , going out in field service , the brother thought it best not to violate his conscience by sitting at same table and eating lunch with me .
Here is an example of why we want to warn people. I have a JW cousin she was very strict with her four kids. She wouldn’t take her kids to disneyland because they are gay friendly and because of tinker bell the fairy. All four of her kids are disfellowshipped and she doesn’t speak to them. I warn people.
I know people in similar situations. How could they possibly feel good about themselves for shunning their children? Surely their Christian heart has gone out the window? How do they sleep at night not knowing where their children are?
Yes we all have to keep speaking out to those who are “sighing & crying over the detestable things”. Our family has had the best sucess warning ones those who have been treated badly by the “org.” (so called disfellowshipped ones and other people who have been marginalized by Watchtower). Thank you for the article! Let’s all join in and keep others from being harmed by this awful cult.
I would appreciate some opinions. I’ve never been a JW. Over ten years ago I got divorced and my ex wife shortly after married and eventually became immersed into JW. This has caused a lot of parental alienation: the kids not uncomfortable during holidays, withdrawing from our church youth group, and so on.
Recently, my 18 year old daughter texted me and asked if we could come to her baptism. She said it would mean a lot to her. I’ve gone back and forth in my head what to do. My wife suggested we explain to my daughter that we do not agree with the JW teachings but go anyway. She thinks if I don’t go my daughter will completely withdraw from us. My heart is sad she has drifted from our Christian faith. It’s not a moment for me to celebrate. Any advice?
Kirk, can I ask how immersed your daughter is in it? The reason I ask is if you do go it is like giving her a green light that you except it. If you don’t she may have resentment that you don’t support her. She is after all an adult now.
Would she listen to any reasoning? she may or may not look at literature on here. She may already have been told to stay away from ‘apostate’ sites and literature. When I first came into the org, I was terrified of the apostates gathered outside the assembly halls – how I wished I had spoken to them.
Once she says ‘yes’ to the baptism questions she will be beholden to their rules. It is a contract that will hold her for life unless she is df’d, disassociates or fades. It’s like the small print you don’t actually read but is used against you. I suggest you look at the info. on this site for Baptism and then ask her if she is totally prepared to except the rules. If she is, then all you can do is prepare yourself with information that you can use to reason with her over the coming years and promise that you will be there for her if and when she wakes up.
I refused to listen to my siblings. After all I was going to live forever and if they didn’t listen then they would die. How grateful I am that they are still there for me now I have woken up.
Please research Baptism. I feel so bad for you. But all is not lost.
Perhaps if you feel you need to be there, just go for the Baptism and then leave. It’s usually done around noon. The last part of the morning session.
Just another thought. Ask her if she would be allowed to attend a Baptism/wedding/funeral at your church once she is baptised. For the most part I believe it would be a matter of conscience however just looking up a few comments I noticed that attending a baptism/christening at a church would be a no no. She could be reproved for this one.
This is so wonderful. The ones who have recently left or are in the process of leaving are now helping those who have serious problems and are feeling lost and confused to show them the way. They are paying it forward. In this way. We can all help each other. God bless all of you who come on here and help with your comments, ideas and lots of input to help those who need it.
Congratulate her on her faith and desire to serve God, tell her you’ll gladly go, but to please out of consideration to you, spend some time at http://www.jwfacts.com before she signs her contract with this cult. Remind her that Jesus was baptized at 30 years of age.
Thanks Robert. I knew someone would have a good idea on where to look.
@ Kirk
Robert67 gave excellent advice but please be aware that your daughter may not be inclined to review the info at jwfacts.com as JWs are are strongly warned and indoctrinated that they should not visit what the Watchtower claims are “apostate” websites.
So more than likely you will have to read the information regarding baptism at jwfacts.com yourself and ask her questions based on this information. In addition to the baptism info there are also some excellent questions regarding baptism at jwfacts.com which have already been prepared and which you could ask her as well.
Since persons are usually inclined to be a little more receptive and not tune others out when the information being used to reason with them comes from the Watchtower’s own publications, it is best that you ask your daughter to find the Watchtower publications which jwfacts.com quotes from so that she can see the information for herself.
Also, it would be good to review the comments made by Caltanzee & Caroline(formerly anonymous) on this post regarding the Watchtower publication: MANKIND’S SEARCH FOR GOD. Again, using the info from the Watchtower’s own publication in reasoning with your daughter can be quite effective.
Hopefully you will have enough time to do these things before the baptism comes around.
If all of this fails, then it is my opinion that you should attend her baptism and let her know that any good parent would love for their child to take the worship of God seriously and lead good lives but that you have concerns about JW teachings.
Not attending will more than likely be interpreted as opposition and this is what the Watchtower wants. JWs are taught that they will suffer ridicule and be hated on account of Jesus’ name and that Satan will cause family members to say bad things about the religion as Jesus did say that a person’s enemies will be members of his own household and he came to turn family members against each other (Matthew 10:35, 36). JWs therefore view opposition as a sign that they must be doing it right, and that this must be “the truth” as, after all Jesus did say that they should expect persecution.
JWs are taught that they will be persecuted for their faith. It’s almost a prerequisite for being a JW, but it is the Watchtower’s way of making people become isolated, alienated, disconnected and estranged from their non-witness family members should these family members oppose them. So be careful in how you oppose your daughter, as she may begin to see you as her enemy and you may end up losing her.
Thank you, everyone. I’m sure we will attend. It will be uncomfortable. Hopefully, she will eventually come around.
Kirk,
When you go to her baptism there will be an emotional pull from her as well, she will try to convince you how wonderful everyone is & when everyone knows who you are, they will love bomb you to make you think this is the most loving & happy organisation on earth. Don’t be fooled by it though, these people lead just as tragic lives as anyone else out there in the world. There is a lot of depression hiding behind the smiling loveliness. They’re just good at hiding the negative aspects of it & advertising the glossy version of it.
She is blindsided by the faith at this point & will not listen to one thing negative about it. Tread carefully with how you approach her because you can very easily push her further in if she senses a little negativity from you.
I would suggest just being there for her as a loving family on the side line but make sure that she knows that you will never be converted but you respect her choice.
There are a lot of backstabbers & holier than thou’s in the org. I was in her position once & my family were like you, they were worried for me & tried to get me to see things but I just thought that they were under satan’s control at the time so they didn’t know what to do except be there for me. Hopefully one day, she will see it for what it is. Be patient though, it took me 20 years to finally admit that it was a silly religion.
Not everyone has horrible experiences in the organisation (I did) & I don’t know what her experiences will be so subtle little gems to make her question things might be your best option.
Kirk,
Your heart may be sad about the baptism but I know you will always find ways to show her how much you love her. Never stop loving her, always be present in her life in whatever way you can so that if the day should come when she does wake up and want to leave the cult, then she won’t hesitate to do so as she knows that she has someone to turn to who loves her unconditionally as her family members who remain in the cult will be inclined to shun/withdraw from her if she should leave as this is what the Watchtower’s teachings encourage.
Just be there for her on this day. That is VERY important. She will remember that above all. Nothing right now can stop her from this course. Later, we will all help you in getting her free.
For me, besides all of those things you outlined, I sincerely want to see our species progress. I want to know that when I leave this world, we are at least on the right path to making it a better place for us all. As long as we allow any harmful, unfounded, fantastical beliefs to poison our conversations, we will be setting up barriers for our own progress.
Human beings are not the horrible sinners, incapable of governing themselves, that the JWs and other religious groups like to indoctrinate people into believing. If we only focused more on all that we have been able to accomplish, despite our flaws, then we could inspire ourselves to do better, to be better.
Religion, I believe, is the antithesis to progress. It is simply another form of tribalism, and IMO, the most dangerous kind, and here’s why: people generally recognize that tribalism is bad. Most racists won’t even label themselves as racists, they say things like, “I’m not a racist but….”, and then go on to spew some racist nonsense. But it’s difficult for them to admit that they are racist because they intrinsically recognize it is wrong. Religion is a form of tribalism that, unlike other forms, not only do people think it is good, but they think it is the best possible ideology they can have to govern their lives, so much so that they are not content with believing their propositions, but they go out of their way to try and make other people believe as well.
Think about it. When a JW knocks on your door to preach the “good news”, what they are really saying is, “join me in despising homosexuals, join me in putting innocent people’s lives at risk because of unfounded, unscientific beliefs about blood, join me in the self-depreciation of your self worth, join me in living in fear of things that don’t exist, join me in discouraging children from getting a higher education that will help them live a better life”.
This is why I speak out against JW and all religions. We can do better, we must do better.
Richard, nothing would be better than for humanity to simply evolve into a peaceful member of the Starfleet Federation, but sadly it is not in mans nature. I don’t know if you’ve ever read up on anything Sam Harris, but he makes great arguments as to why men will always be violent and his ultimate nature, without any forethought to a higher power will lead humanity to complete nihilism. Every last one of us are here because we will not “live and let live” as pertains to this cult. We have chosen, not to simply walk away silently into the night, but feel a need to fight back by revealing the truth about the WT “truth”.This isn’t the case for every person, just the absolute majority.
It’s true we are violent in nature.. we evolved from apes, highly territorial creatures. But we have improved, we have managed to make great strides in overcoming our inherent tribalism. We will never completely get rid of it, because, as you said, it is in our nature, but we must continue to chip away at it nonetheless. That is how progress is made, one small step at a time.
One thing I can never comes to terms with is how God could allow such suffering.
We are imperfect but we seem to be doing more for humanity than God. God in his perfect state can’t feel as horrified and sick at the world and the perfect animals he created are suffering yet they don’t sin.
Really I am finding it very hard to understand this sort of Godly love.
Well, ignoring the church of atheism services being held here, back on topic.
If it weren’t for the testimony against this publishing company given by so many here, many of us would still be suffering on the fence of two opinions. Thank you to everyone who has helped those of us with an unnecessarily overburdened consience break completely free of these false Watchtower interpretations of scripture. There is still a lot of work to do, keep sharing your experiences and I hope everyone has had a chance of watching the latest John Cedars youtube video. What a gold mine of truth.
I especially loved when the false prophet on jwbroadcasting is ranting on about being more Christ like helping others in need, regardless if they will allow us to preach to them or not. This completely contradicts all those talks we’ve heard about not blowing our money away on these fake beggars living in cardboard boxes, that any coin we give them is just blown on alcohol or drugs anyway. A much better use of the few coins we can spare is to support the global preaching work( Planet JW resort in Walkil) and the elites comfy lifestyle.
We know now what they’ve done with so many Bethelites after holding the carrot in front of them for so long. We know our donations are being used to pay off multi million dollar sex abuse settlements. We know about the luxurious lifestyle of these men that wear watches that could pay for the lifetime needs of pioneers in third world countries.
Please watch the whole video and you have to SUBSCRIBE in order to receive them the moment they are released. If you are not able to send in a paypal donation to support this site, atleast subscribe and watch the helpful videos on the John Cedars channel
http://youtu.be/-3v6-oLtuhU
Robert67,
Please do not demean those of us who are atheists.
We want to work with you and other Christians to assist people in the WTBTS to free themselves, and to assist ex JWs with their many issues.
There is no need for dispute between us.
I hope that this will be an exception to your usually pertinent and informative comments.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
Very well said, Jeni! I agree with all your statements and sentiments. My family has been involved in this cult for 6 generations with such sad results. There is a handful of us who have either left or faded. We are shunned by all the others. We do our best to support one another, but it is hard to be cut off and left out by the rest.
Well said. I appreciate your honesty and desire to help.
Thanks sooo much Jeni for this article! It helps to know that anyone who has been a victim of the watchtowers abuse is not alone. It hurts to feel like you’re the only one when they unjustly abuse you.They are so abusive in many ways a bunch of bullies.
The funny thing is that when circuit overseers go to check up on the congragations EVERYONE puts on a mask.
Then the circuit overseers report back to the branch saying “How Wonderful! Everyone is doing”..
Its all a game like in A Movie where everyone is acting the abused and the abusers.
And the Gvbody are dancing around with their pants down naked and shameful.(Rev.16:15)
Then the gvbody are adding on to the bible about this generation, changing the whole meaning and definition of it .. thats so evil!!
Yet they are lecturing about how someone dressses..
Have you seen how everyone is worshipping the jw.org. symbol! ! ((Rolling my eyes back))
Its a bit on the funny side ,, naked men with blind people saying “These men know everything.”..
Please keep up the work and yes we speak out because we are victims in some way not because we are bad…
Just watched the video about the autism kid..it was actually so sad because I noticed the kid suffered being in the congr. UNTIL the doctor explained that his behavior was due to autism and it had happened recent (based off the reenactment. )
So if the doctor hadnt diagnosed him then the Poor kid would still be suffering..
It seemed as like everyone was getting irritated with him Until the doctor said he had autism then they all celebrated. .how sad!!
Maybe GOD felt pity for him and confused the doctor to wrongly diagnose him as Autism so that this he poor kid can get some relief!
I was extremely irritated with the video about the autistic child. I have an classic autistic child about as severe as it gets. Going to conventions, meetings are/were extremely difficult for him. So when I started to fade I asked him if we wanted to go and he said “NO!” I never asked him again. My family thinks I have sacrificed him and I said no I’m saving him. I hate it when WT tell parents of children with disorders how to train their children. And shame on the parents in this video for not realizing their child needed help sooner! I knew when my child was 2 that there was something wrong.
It’s always sad to lose people you love. But I also think that the reason those people are not in our lives is because we are Gods Children and those people still wish to be ruled by Satans Organization.
Yes Satans Organization. They are taught to be unforgiving, unloving to sinners, try to shame Gods children, talk about God as if he’s a dictator, require blood sacrifice in an illness or injury, allow abuse to go on in families, breaks families apart over sin instead of being a uniting force, burden people like the Pharisees, have the Watchtower pillars and numerous other identifying marks of the satanic cult of enochian Magic…. The list goes on.
You were saved from this. You are Gods children. You are protected from this evil. Pray for these slaves of Satan.
I forgot the most important sign of all that this is Satans Organization:
They call themselves the Truth and when they say to listen to Jehovah- they mean their Organization.
They have made themselves God. Pretending to sort the wheat from the weeds; doing Gods job.
ALL of their prophecies have NOT come true. They are by definition, according to the bible, a false prophet.
You are so right Joy its nice to know im not the only one Sees whats going on.
You said it Mama Joy!
They are, by their definition, just another sect of Christendom.
I feel so damaged by the abuse from year after year..no where to turn..
And they are a prime example of what a modern day Pharasee is.
Their new article for public Nov. Has an article on hypocrisy..THAT IS THEM, their own article says who They are (Hypocrites)
When you read watchtowers the and compare talks from their leaders , it dont always match Contradicting, or showing ungodlyness and teaching otherwise.
So much pain from even the so called true followers.
Yes, they have prophesied for years about themselves. Maybe God wanted it to come out of their own mouths for some reason.
IMO, Robert67 sometimes stretches posting guidelines
to the limit, if not at times overstepping.
IMO, Richard & Kat made some well founded comments,
but because they they were not in agreement with Roberts
well publicised Theistic views, he dismisses them, almost
as if only his own perceptions were worth considering .
Roberts remark, “Ignoring the church of atheism services
being held here”. Appears to be directed at Richard & Kat,
Snide comments are used by bigots who are intolerant of
other people’s views, and is something opposed to the
purpose of this fine site. Confrontation is not something
I enjoy, but sometimes there is a need to speak ones mind.
@Ted I am in complete agreement with you regarding Robert.. He is constantly over the line when it comes to the posting guidelines for this site. The length of his posts at times are excessive at times as well. Almost as annoying as unwelcome door knockers on a Saturday morning….
@Ted
OFF-TOPIC COMMENTS – Do not post comments that are off-topic and bear no relation to the page or article
RELIGIOUS NEUTRALITY – Do not post comments that are evangelical in nature or may be construed as imposing one person’s religious beliefs (or lack thereof) over those of another
Please note the (lack thereof) portion of the rules. Even the creator of this site quotes scripture in order to help and prove to those still on the fence that this cult twist the scriptures that 99.9999% of people on the fence still respect.
Again, if it were my first time visiting this site through a recommendation and I’m skimming through the comments section of this article and all I see is God bashing or God denying (which I respect if that’s the way you swing) then that person or persons will have seen that everything the GB warns them about these sites is true.
Maybe I’m not getting it, are we here to help? or are we here to push our own agendas. If your angry at a God you don’t even believe in, there is a plathora of sites where you can discuss that subject, here in this article, the subject is Speaking out against the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society not Speaking out against a God. (There are many that people believe in)
You guys have to be kidding. Where is anything this guy is saying out of line. Im looking at all the comments and it seems you just came in here to attack and havent contributed anything else yet your jumping on Rob67
@dusty its pretty simple really…
RELIGIOUS NEUTRALITY – Do not post comments that are evangelical in nature or may be construed as imposing one person’s religious beliefs (or lack thereof) over those of another
LINKS – You may post links to third party websites, so long as (1) you limit these to 2 links per comment, and (2) the content on these links doesn’t contravene ANY of the first four points. Specifically, you may not post URLs to websites that are evangelical in nature. Our links page has an extensive list of such sites for any who are curious about Christian beliefs in the context of Jehovah’s Witnesses.
It hasn’t only happened on this thread. It’s interesting that a couple of (very minor) comments about the posting guidelines (especially when you take into account the PB incident ) that some people would be more sensitive about keeping to the posted guidelines than others. It’s not like anyone called for him to be banned…
Kirk
Regarding your daughter becoming involved, and now baptised, into what she will regard as “The Truth”.
A few months ago I went into a Cornish chapel where a craft market was being held, and a friendly woman was serving free cups of tea. She was part of a Pentecostalist religious group, . I know they believe in “Speaking in tongues”and I was interested in her experience. I simply asked her what happened at her services, and what she believed in.. She proceeded to describe to me how individuals within the congregation would speak out in an unintelligible way, moved, as she understood it, by the holy spirit, to prophesy. Another member of the group would then speak, translating or explaining the unintelligible words.
The important thing was that she said to me “it feels rather strange to see my faith in this way, to tell you about in this way makes it seem like a strange belief”.
A few years ago when I was fading as a JW a work colleague was preparing to visit a Kingdom Hall to discuss an insurance claim. He asked me what they believed in. I told him that they believed very soon god was going to destroy everyone who was not a Jehovah’s Witness, at Armageddon. They believed that after Armageddon there would be logistical challenges for the survivors dealing with 7 billion dead bodies. Then they would live for 1000 years before being tested again, and if they passed that test they would live for ever on planet Earth.
After Armageddon the JW survivors would notice that their deceased loved ones and relatives and most of the people who had died before Armageddon would pop up, fit and well ready to live with them on a “Paradise earth”, probably though not able to have sex.
In describing my beliefs this way I experienced a similar thing to the Pentecostalist tea serving lady. I experienced holding JW beliefs I n a different way.
Perhaps when you meet with your daughter you can politely and respectfully ask her what she believes is going to happen in the future and who can benefit. They are trained to lie about their belief that only JWs will survive Armageddon, and she will fudge that point. If asked who will survive Armageddon she will say that she doesn’t know, only Jehovah does. However if you ask her whether the local catholic priest will survive, or the attendees at the local mosque, she will be forced to realise that she does know some who won’t.
I believe that as long as your intention is to fully understand in as much depth as possible what she currently believes in in relation to the future, then there is, In my opinion, a chance that she could experience her beliefs from a different perspective. This may provide her with some insight.
It’s a long strategic game. And you won’t know if you have planted seeds of doubt until much later.
Attacking their faith merely provokes a defensive attitude, and then nothing penetrates. Absolutely nothing.
SwimmingWild
@SwimingWild, you are so right about them lying about Jehovah killing everybody who is not a JW at Armageddon.
A couple weeks ago when my husband was in the hospital, a nurse came in and asked him about what makes Jehovah’s Witnesses’ religion different than “Christian” religions and I spoke up and told her that Jehovah’s Witnesses claim to be a Christian religion but they believe that Armageddon is going to happen at any time and anybody who is not one of Jehovah’s Witnesses will be killed and she disagreed and said that she believed in the Lord Jesus Christ etc. etc.
After she left, my husband told me that I had no business speaking about what “they” believe since I don’t profess to be one anymore but I told him that I was one for fifty years and he had no business telling me that but he argued and said I was wrong about what I said. I asked him what I was wrong about and he said that “no, Jehovah wasn’t going to kill everybody who wasn’t one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.” He said it all depended on people’s heart conditions instead. So I asked him then, “so why do we have to go from door to door, if they only have to have the right heart condition?”
I have been in service with pioneer sisters and when the householders ask them that question, they won’t say “yes, everybody who isn’t a Jehovah’s Witness will be killed at Armageddon” and I wonder why they don’t want to admit that since that is what makes their work so urgent????
My six year old grandchild was told by her jw friends that her df’d daddy was going to die soon at armageddon. My son is divorced from his daughter mother, a reinstated witness. Her uncle, an elder, told me that as soon as she is baptised she will no longer be able to communicate with her father/my son. What a loving christian organisation eh.
Sorry, my ex daughter in laws, uncle that is.
Tara, I think it might be a good idea for your son to let his lawyer know what is being said. The lawyer can have it written on paper the child isn’t allowed to hear any parent bashing. This may be the only way the child’s mother will know her x is paying attention. The only way you can stop a bully from bullying is by making them feel uncomfortable doing it.
The funny thing is Catalina, that my son’s lawyer was married to a JW so he knows exactly what goes on lol.
Jehovah’s rules over a bunch of stupid rules…
“If a sin is widely known or will undoubtedly become known, an announcement to the congregation would likely be appropriate in order to protect its reputation. An announcement will also be made if the congregation needs to be informed.” (w06 11/15 p. 30 par. 20)
Hello,
Thank you, Thank you … THANK you …
I often wonder me why I talk on forum against JW
( on Blood, -607, shunning etc. )
Sometimes I stop , but , after all , I don’t answer to JW people , but to inform whom they could be interresed by JW message …
I want to say what “IS” exactly JW and Watchtower.
I’m always JW due to my familly ( my wife ) … but in my head I’m free :)
Thank You again :) From France :)
Yes I’ m a little froggy :)
keinlezard, welcome. Stay free. It’s a good place to be.
@Dusty Roads.
Sorry, but you completely mis-understand my motive.
There’s no intention of jumping on anyone’s back.
I’m just speaking out against an attitude I feel is bad.
( which is what this thread is about.)
We’re all well aware that being dismissive of other
people’s beliefs is something that’s imprinted on the
JW psyche. It’s a mindset that most of us have managed
to root out and so is rarely encountered on this site, but
if and when it does occur, I will, if allowed. Continue
to speak out against it.
I know many people on this site have retained their faith in god … I have not and I trust this site not to belittle me because I am an atheist now…I dont judge anymore…its such a relief… but I did think that sometimes the terms used about atheists by some contributers was demeaning… maybe Im a bit sensitive….but I love this feeling that everyone is entitled to believe what they want without recrimination…its so wonderful.
@Ted
How can you not see the insensitivity of going off topic (Speaking out against the WT) to blurt out a bunch of anti God sentiments. Is this not a site that focuses on helping people on the fence come out of this cult. Have we not spoken before about posting negative comments that would scare first time visitors away? Do the rules not specify NOT promoting your lack of faith as well. Would it be ok for me to go on rants about the Prophet Mohamad being a pedophile that married a six year old girls or Budda being obese or saying Atheist are deranged and ignore this, that and the other? Absolutely not, so I don’t, but I do get things back on track when others do it. It seems the only time you jump out of the bushes is when someone does this. If I post a link or a scripture it is to help visitors see how the WT either ignore or twist that scripture or to help educate others as to the false origin story this organization tells people.
I am completely free in mind and spirit. This Borg no longer has any hold on me, I can happily go on living my life without looking back, but I don’t, because I am committed to helping others escape this cult, without any pro atheist or pro evangelical agenda.
If I see anyone promoting their new found church, temple, mosk, synagogue etc… Ill be the first to jump in and tell them to take it elsewhere and keep it on subject.
If anyone decides to post an oh, by the way God, Budda, Alah, Zeus etc..is a jerk comment, ill jump on that as well.
Still love ya, Ted.
Robert, I looked at previous comments from Ted and Richard and others and I don’t see any anti-God rants but I do think it is perfectly fair to point out scriptures about the God Jehovah and let people who want to read those scriptures come to their own conclusions.
I think the best way to bring down a religion is to attack it’s source and if that source is flawed, that is the easiest way to attack the root of the problem.
When it comes to the Bible, people can interpret certain scriptures any way they want to and if those scriptures don’t fit their idea of what a perfect God is supposed to be like in their way of thinking, then they come up with a Bible that takes certain scriptures and put in different words to make people think that the God they worship is a loving and just God, like for instance what the Watchtower did with what the Bible says about Jepthah’s daughter being burned as a sacrifice to Jehovah.
Jepthah burned his daughter as a sacrifice to Jehovah, plain and simple.
The Watchtower wants people to think that the God they have invented in their own mind would never do such a thing so they rewrote the Bible the way they think that the God, Witnesses worship would never do such a thing but unfortunately that is exactly what happened.
There is nothing wrong in telling people about the God they worship. If it hurts their feelings, then maybe instead of being angry about it, they should look up those scriptures for themselves. Most atheists became atheists because they actually did read their Bibles. That is what made them atheists.
When it comes to anti God comments, atheists don’t believe in God so they can’t be anti-God. They could only be anti-God if they actually did believe in Him. If they did believe in God, then the obvious questions begs to be answered: Why doesn’t God answer prayers? Is He not able to answer prayers or does he not care? These answered prayers have to be things that could never happen on their own. They would have to be supernatural. Has anybody any evidence of things like that ever happening?
Saying that God doesn’t want anybody to be destroyed and wants everyone to live forever, like what the Watchtower says God is doing by waiting for Armageddon to wipe out all tears and pain, is a cop out. It’s the get out of jail free card.
Ray Franz’s book “In Search of Christian Freedom” points out that people don’t need an organized religion to worship God. Being against organized religion is not being against God like what you suggested. You have to believe in God to be against Him and I for one don’t believe in Him but I don’t care if anybody else wants to believe in God but what they must realize is that I don’t have to worship their God, the God of the Hebrew Scriptures and even the God of the Greek Scriptures who wants to kill every man woman and child who doesn’t profess to worship him at Armageddon.
If God doesn’t want anybody to be destroyed, then why did he make it so hard for people to know who He even is? Why doesn’t he do anything to prove to people who he is and what he wants of people?
Saying the earth is a circle, doesn’t do it for me. If you can come up with anything to prove to me that God actually exists, I would love to hear of it.
It is up to each person to decide what their beliefs post JW world will be . Some persons will choose to become born again Christians/evangelicals, some will choose to be ecumenical/non-denominational, some will decide that they believe that a Supreme Being created the universe but wish to have nothing to do with organized religion and some will choose to become atheists.
Whatever our personal choices are regarding our belief system post-JW world, it is my opinion that our objectives when participating in this forum should be to help:
1. JWs learn the truth about their cult.
2. JWs free themselves from the cult.
3. Persons who may be considering becoming members realize that they are about to join a cult and to learn the truth about its teachings.
4. Ex-JWs deal with Watchtower-related issues.
☺☺☺
***……..help:
5. Non-JWs who are concerned about their friends & family members in the cult (like Kirk).
***……..help:
4. Ex-JWs heal, de-program, get the WT out of their heads & system for good and deal…….
Robert67,
Sir, you raise some very valid points.
However, I have a different view about an enforced unity of thought.
Let us pretend to be a “first time visitor” to this esteemed site, shall we?
I grant you this, someone stumbling upon this site may possibly be “stumbled” by diverse comments.
However, a deliberate visitor to an apostate site will, I strongly believe, be attracted to polite, respectful disagreement, rather than be repelled by it.
I agree with you that, as this cult is using the bible to fabricate legitimacy for its cult mind control, we need to use the bible to debunk these mind control hijacks of biblical lore.
I would humbly entreat you to consider the feelings of those of us with no faith in your comments. No one benefits from a lack of fellow feeling.
One of the gravest errors of the WTBTS is the belief that Unity is worth any cost. It is not. The ends never justify the means.
We must have the ability to disagree with the knowledge that we are conversing with a fellow human being. These are not just words on a comments section. They are the thoughts and feelings of human beings.
Ted is a long standing commenter on this site. He is a man wise in age and experience, and I and many others benefit from that in his comments.
Sir, your desire to emulate Jesus Christ is an honourable goal. He does not require you to defend Him by making ill judged swipes at atheists. He requires you to love as He first loved you. 1 John 4:16 – 19
Does the love of the Lord have limits? Is He not the mediator and saviour of everyone? Are we not all God’s children?
I know that we shall remain united in our genuine desire to assist those who are trapped in the cult of the WTBTS. Our loving compassion for our fellow human beings is both a Christian and a Humane thing to do.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
I still hold to not pushing our beliefs here on others.There is a difference between Atheism and being non-religious. Being non-religious sets aside the god issue, that is where I fall in. Atheism asserts there is no god. The two are commonly confused. Because there is no empirical means for establishing the existence or non-existence of god, Atheism is a faith. It is the belief in the non-existence of god. I think it is a good thing for people who are atheists, agnostics, doubters and seekers to have a place where open minded thought, discussion and debate can happen and be shared. Doing it here is the equivalent of recruiting for any other belief and would demonstrate a clear ulterior motive for the existence of this site.
Robert67,
We shall have to agree to disagree, sir.
How can one have a faith in the non existence of a deity or deities? That statement makes no sense, I’m afraid.
It is for those with a belief in God to provide proof. The laws of physics do not require a God or gods to be. These were set at the beginning of the universe.
I also disagree with your assertion that discussing atheism is automatically recruiting others to believe in atheism. It is simply offering an alternative explanation for the universe we experience.
The simple fact is that it is up to those with faith in a deity or deities to prove they exist. It is not up to atheists to prove the opposite.
I am sorry that you consider discussion to be proselytism. I have no desire to “make disciples” for the atheist cause. I simply see it as a positive thing to present a possible alternative to traditional faiths.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
@Robert67:
Both theist ex-JWs and non-theist ex-JWs have issues with the Watchtower’s (WT) teachings. It seems what you are suggesting is that only the theist ex-JWs should be allowed to comment on their WT issues on this site. I am not sure if that should be the case.
Robert67,
I would also like to add that I am very appreciative of your polite and helpful response to my comment.
Thank you for demonstrating admirably the positive and polite way to debate on this site.
Peace be with you, Excelsior!
@Robert, a lot of people like to say that being an atheist is a faith. I used to say the same thing but I don’t think like that anymore.
If I don’t believe in Santa Claus so that isn’t a religion, not believing in Santa Clause so it’s not a religion or faith not to believe in Santa Clause. Atheism is simply not believing in God, the same as not believing in Santa Claus but there is no name for not believing in Santa Clause.
Atheism isn’t asserting there is no God. It is just saying that unless there is solid evidence of a supernatural God or creator or supernatural miracles performed by God, they won’t believe it, just as people won’t believe there is a Santa Clause flying through the air at Christmas time is real, unless they see him flying through the air.
There would have to be more than one sane person who witnesses it at the same time too. All kinds of insane people see stuff but the Witnesses have to be sane.
The JW Witnesses like to tell stories like how they were standing at the door of a serial killer and the serial killer supposedly saw two big strong men standing next to her and that is why they didn’t attack the Witness, but you have to remember the serial killer was nuts and the Witness sister never saw the two big strong men (angels supposedly).
People misunderstand what it means to be atheist. All atheists are really agnostic. How could a person deny the existence of a supernatural God if they saw him at the Super Bowl, to quote Bill Mahr.
It is too convenient that the only ones who saw actual miracles were in the Bible.
To quote AronRa, Faith is not a virtue.
Questions to ask Jehovah’s Witnesses:
1. Did Jesus Christ have lawyers?
2. Did Jesus Christ ever ask for money?
3. Did Jesus Christ consider construction work, a sacred activity?
4. Did Jesus Christ ever think that construction work was more important than preaching work?
5. Did Jesus Christ ever record his time in the preaching work?
6. Do we have any recorded evidence of how much time Jesus Christ spent in preaching?
7. Would Jesus Christ ever say to a child not to preach his message if you are wearing a certain type of clothes?
8. Did Jesus Christ ever beg for money?
9. Did Jesus Christ ever abuse children and try to cover it up?
10. Did Jesus Christ ever disrespect people for having a different philosophy than he had?
11. Did Jesus Christ ever shun people?
12. Was Jesus Christ’s love ever conditional?
13. Did Jesus Christ ever disfellowship, disconnect, excommunicate people who had a different opinion?
14. Did Jesus Christ ever live in a resort near a lake?
15. Did Jesus Christ condemn people for wearing tight robes?
May l add…
Did Jesus own a rollex, have a state of the art studio to broadcast his prerecorded, edited monthly sermons?
Call anyone and everyone apostate that didn’t agree with him?
Completely flip flop on his doctrine?
Secretly, join a Roman governmental agency, that promoted Rome’s interests in Palestine?
Claimed to be a prophet, but just in case it didn’t work out, threw in the disclaimer that if it failed he was just a “sincere student of the word and was making an educated guess?”
Doc Obvious,
Thank you so much for those great questions. You have given me something to work on. I have been waiting for someone to give me some ideas about what questions to ask JW’s to give them something to think about without sounding too apostate or confrontational.
10. Did Jesus Christ ever disrespect people for having a different philosophy than he had?
“Jesus entered the Temple and began to drive out all the people buying and selling animals for sacrifice. He knocked over the tables of the money changers and the chairs of those selling doves.” (Matt 21:12)
“Jesus called the Scribes and Pharisees “fools, hypocrites, blind guides, whited sepulchers, murderers, a generation of snakes,” and many such epithets. Jesus called them “hypocrites” seven times in one chapter. He spoke with scathing derision to the Scribes and Pharisees throughout His ministry; very few of them received a kind word from Him.”
http://bible-truths.com/fools.htm
@ScotWm:
Your comment perhaps shows one of the reasons why some persons have abandoned organized religion – they no longer wish to judge, they rather live and let live, they have had enough of ‘my religion is right and yours is wrong’. These things only serve to divide.
The answer to question #10 is one that all Jehovah’s Witnesses need to carefully consider.
Jesus’ expressed disgust with the Scribes, Pharisees and money changers.
Most of us here have determined that the Watchtower’s Governing Body is comprised of the same types of fools, hypocrites, blind guides and money grabbers that Jesus hated.
Some have even suggested that the Governing Body is guilty of murder due to its blood doctrines and suicides induced by shunning.
@ScotWm:
Thanks for that explanation…….we all should be disgusted with these things.
OH my! Is it this obvious (pardon the pun Doc) I reckon you have just about summed up all that needs to be thought about and any thinking person who can answer these questions WILL come to the right conclusion.Stupid cult.Stupid people> me included! ruthlee
If you don’t want to get shunned and for them to leave you alone, all you have to do is threaten to sue the Judicial Committee over Human Rights violations.
I am sure they would drop the whole matter once their own livelihood comes under attack.
Please help me. I’m feeling sad. I need help with my attitude. That’s another reason for speaking out, it helps people cope. My brother and sister are strong JWs. My sister isn’t speaking to my brother because he associates with his daughter who committed adultery. My brother isn’t speaking to my sister and says the ground would have opened up and swallowed her during Moses time because she isn’t speaking to him or his daughter who is now in good standing. My sister isn’t speaking to them because she feels his daughter got away with it. My brother and my sister aren’t speaking to me because I refused to go door to door, I married out of the truth and now I’m inactive. They are so judgemental. Hard feelings everywhere. I need help adjusting my attitude. My problem is If I saw them walking towards me I’d feel uncomfortable and walk away. Right now I wouldn’t go to their funeral if they died from old age. What can I do to feel more positive? I hope I don’t feel so bitter three years from now. I know I need help in adjusting my attitude. I get frustrated and I think, what is the matter with me? I need to know will I feel better later? I hope so. Right now it would be uncomfortable if I saw them. Someone help me adjust my attitude. I wish my mother was alive. I think to much.
Something that cheers me up when I think of my parents and siblings is knowing that the wall of lies is crumbling around this cult. While I wait I try not to push too hard on a direct front. The only thing I can do from the inside is pick up on the activism and make sure they stumble unto it. Also pick up on my ability to debunk the vast majority of this cults doctrines using the same Bible they only claim to adhere to.
I am leaving Puerto Rico pretty soon and am happy to say that I have helped quite a few at least find all of this information and their conversations indicate they already have a foot out of the door.
We are free now Catalina. Free to live a much fuller life, free of the guilt, the slave labor, the fixed schedules, the manipulated guilt, the salesmen uniform, the dork haircuts, I am going to start growing a beard and I won’t stop until I hit Gandolf. I will use said beard to never have to turn down mic’s, reading or any other “privilege” merit badge. The beard while not enough to get me kicked out, will disqualify me from any of those much coveted (smirking) perks.
Enjoy life Catalina. Try to increase your local activism eventually you’ll find the right moment to help them stumble into it. It is only a question of time now, everytime another WT secret society tidbit is exposed, they only tighten the noose around the friends even more. I know many have already tapped out subconsciously, they will simply fall away at different events. We will be here to spread events as they happen as far and wide as we can.
Catalina,
I have had those feelings (not to family) as they aren’t JW’s but to the still-in JW’s that run the other way when they see me in the street. I’m just glad that I have my husband to support me because I get so down about it but he just thinks that they are stupid & fearing men not God. Otherwise they would come up & talk to me to encourage me if they knew that they had the truth. They wouldn’t cower like they do but they know deep down that their faith is unstable. I wish that I could be thick skinned like him.
when I feel like that, I re-read Steve Hassens book “combatting mind control” to remind me that they are victims of a silly religious cult that adds so much more stress & anxieties to people than they need in their lives. It’s such a mind bending religion that creates so many other issues that don’t need to be. I have to tell myself to just shake it off & free myself of what’s not worth wasting my energy thinking about.
@Catalina, just writing it down here, might help you to feel better. The only thing that will get us all out of this hell (once we realize the Watchtower is a sham) is for it to come crashing down.
There are several Youtube videos up showing the Annual meeting part with Samuel Herd saying how they are cutting Watchtower building projects and cutting the Watchtower and Awake magazines in half etc. and how they are sending Bethelites home etc. and that is the best and most cheerful thing that I am hanging onto at this moment.
The Watchtower won’t come right out and say it, but it doesn’t have enough money for all their projected building projects which means the money is drying up. They like to fool the rank and file into thinking the work is speeding up but it’s the Titanic that’s sinking and they don’t have enough life boats for everybody so they want everybody to stay on the sinking ship until it sinks.
That to me is good news and it cheers me up. You can tell by the looks on the Governing Body’s faces, that they don’t look real happy. At least they don’t look happy to me.
Yesterday, my oldest daughter was over for a visit and one of her pioneer friends who has been sent home from Bethel were talking about how God is speeding up the work and I had to just sit there and not even roll my eyes over it. I pity them but it’s me who they pity because they think they have the truth and I don’t.
Some others at the meeting yesterday were commenting to my husband how much they miss me and asked if they could come over to encourage me but the only thing I think I can say to anybody from now on is that I just don’t believe in the Bible anymore.
If they don’t want anything to do with me because of that, then that show just how much they want to be my friend. I would never turn down a person’s friendship because they said they didn’t believe in God so why do I deserve to be treated like that? I won’t go on and on about the Watchtower Organization.
My husband says they can’t disfellowship me for what I believe but I think they can.
I feel for you with all my heart….I have such antipathy towards my parents…they have passed but I feel so little emotion towards them….I was born into the religion and my father was always prominent in the congregation, Circuit etc…but our family was totally disfunctional with my Mothrr on the brink of mental collapse and addicted to prescription medication since I was 12 and my father with a mile high ego and a temper to match and a serious hidden flirting problem…the times they split up…only I knew…the congregation never did so he carried on being feted by his peers….I feel awful because of my lack of emotion and feeling towards them and the fact they put me in this crazy crazy religion…time is the healer…Im beginning to remember some good times when I felt that they loved me…time is helping …. Im still in this madness because of fear of shunning… but my mind is becoming free every day…you sound like such a feeling and beautiful person…you will come through this emotional obstacle and find the right way to cope for you…I love your comments they help me carry on…I really really just wanted to say something to support you…listen to Excelsior and Ted…Tara and Dee…they help so much…take care.
Thank you everyone.
I’ve come back online to say everyones advice has really helped. You’ve made an impact in a good way. That’s So Awesome.
AnthonyGZ, You’re right, I got used to them and I love whole heartedly. The advice I’m getting from everyone matches my husband’s advice. It helps hearing it from many people. My husband is smart. He’s intelligent. It helps hearing these things from everyone. Thank you everyone the advice really does help. And it backs up my husband. He’s the finest man I know.
Tara said she prayed for courage before. Keep praying, but not to Jehovah. We have no evidence that it is really God’s name. It was the Witnesses who told us that. Pray to the true God through His Son Jesus Christ. I know you are not an atheist and that is why I can say it.
You need strength to hold on to your conviction. Don’t let them suck you back into their way. You are stronger than you think. They are the ones who are making trouble for you. Really, as much as they are saying you are a bad influence, they are a bad influence upon you. Don’t let them drag you down.
Find something interesting to do like visit the local library or learn how to make yourself an apron on Youtube, just get your mind off these mindless people. You are just have a down day. You will feel better tomorrow. If you keep yourself busy, you will probably be out if those pesky elders call too. And have a good conversation to your husband about not letting them inside if they come when you are not there. Hope you are feeling better soon Catalina.
@Doc Obvious
Those are the types of questions that I have asked my witness relatives in the past.
But, you simply cannot question anything about this religion without getting looked at as an evil person who wants to cause trouble. So I stopped asking.
It appears to me that they are happy with the status quo and dont want to change things, even though many witnesses know that all is not right within jwdom.
@ Jeni
I am glad that you chose to speak out and especially about suffering abuse. Like you, I know many of the horrors associated with being a JW personally. I applaud you for being strong and speaking out.
@ All those who are leaving or have just left.
The reality of how little JW’s really care about you becomes obvious quickly when you leave. Do not despair, their are people that will like you for who you are, not how well you measure up to a set of rules set by Watchtower. Look at this small community, Christians, Agnostics, Atheists, etc. Most here get along, not because of being Ex JWs. We get along because we are humans with the common goal of helping others. We were witnesses because we thought that is what we were doing. Once we realized that we were not helping people, we left. I believe most of us still have that same desire and that is why we are here.
I am planning a small event next year in Las Vegas sometime in the fall. I will be providing meals for a couple of days and have acquired a number of hotel rooms that I will provide at no cost for the event for any who wish to come and do not have the ability to pay. I already have several friends that are coming. If you are interested in kicking back and mostly laughing and making new friends, leave me a note and I will send you my email.
Best Wishes to all.
what a wonderful gesture :) I wish I could join you and any others…. Sadly I cannot see it happening for me but for any that do make it, I hope you have a wonderful time :)
Interesting paragraph in the Oct 15, 2015 study wt. Pg 31.
and what should you do if you find slanderous news about Jehovah’s organization on the internet? Such material should be firmly rejected. Some feel they must bring it to the attention of others to get their opinion, but all that does is propagate the malicious information. If we feel troubled about something we see on the internet, we should ask Jehovah for wisdom and speak to mature brothers about it. Jesus, who was the object of false accusations, warned his followers that enemies would persecute them and ‘lyingly say every sort of wicked thing against [them].’ We need to se ‘thinking ability’ and ‘discernment’ to identify ‘the man speaking perverse things’ and those ‘whose entire course is devious’.
Go to a mature brother! i think not… they would have us hung, drawn and quartered.
Tara, let me see how that’s supposed to work else where, let’s say brother James is collecting the money from the contribution boxes, and low and behold every month it would seem that half of the donations are missing. ..we surely would not want to think anything bad of dear brother Jones, so we would just make it a matter of prayer, and keep up the donations, but if we were to audit the books it would clearly be the same as a baseless accusation.
Your going to have to run that one by me again POW… my brain is fogged tonight…. no I haven’t been on the cooking sherry before you ask lol.
Not to confuse the point, but, if the money don’t add up, we find out why, we have audit after audit in till the books are reconcilied.
Why when it comes to our teachings and.doctrine would we not apply the same diligence.
Hi Tara,
The book of Psalms says children are a gift from God. It says our children are an inheritance from Jehovah. I suggest that we make our own decisions on how we treat our inheritance. That is no one else’s right to interfere with. Remember Jezebel had a man (I think Naboth) killed for not selling his field to the king. He said how could he sell it when it was his inheritance. An inheritance is ours and we decide. That may not win you any brownie points. Just sayin’. Regards
I just found it amusing considering all the wonderful stuff we have on here. WT def. don’t want the minions to see anything they shouldn’t.
Can anyone else verify the New Light interpreting Genesis 4:1-2 and
“4 Then Adam had sexual intercourse with Eve his wife, and she conceived and gave birth to a son, Cain (meaning “I have created”). For, as she said, “With God’s help, I have created a man!” 2 Her next child was his brother, Abel.”
“25 Later on Eve gave birth to another son and named him Seth (meaning “Granted”); for, as Eve put it, “God has granted me another son for the one Cain killed.” 26 When Seth grew up, he had a son and named him Enosh. It was during his lifetime that men first began to call themselves “the Lord’s people.”[d]”
The New Light is Eve was praising Cain, not Able and praised Cain and Seth making each have a big head! Why does the Watchtower Organization want parents not to praise their kids? Why should we praise anyone using their logic, their hand-clapping on Wednesday Night Meetings when they tell who is Pioneering and who is not! The Organization is breaking down faster than any of us could have imagined if “praising your children make’s them have a Big Head!”
Could someone else verify this gem of “new light” delivered from a Bethelite, elder and circus servant? Thank you for verifying this or discrediting it, one of the elders was already jumping all over some parents that love their kids by telling them “The Slave said we need to avoid praising our kids too much!”. He was treated like trash by his alcoholic father and insane mother, please help me verify this!
Praise only belongs to the faithful and discreet slave. ..
It sounds like they’re clutching at straws to make sure that parents kill any sort of esteem that a child may develop. This is more abuse! To connect praising ones child to Cain. These men are getting weirder & weirder.
Think I have missed this one. when did this light from Bethel shine forth upon the minions?
This is taken from this week’s bible (book) study. On Able
Oh lol I never got around to it…. I have it somewhere…. don’t think I even looked at it when we got it at convention. Just threw it in my bag and then in a corner when I got home…. will dust it off and have a look. Got to keep up with the current crap…. i mean light.
Caroline formally Anon,
Caroline, I don’t know whether you play the piano.
But you hit the right notes every time. You always
cut to the chase, without any bells & whistles.
Your comments contain irrefutable logic,and
encourage and inspire. I wish you health and
contentment. Ted.
@Ted, I don’t play the piano but it’s nice to think somebody thinks I hit the right notes! Thanks for saying that!
Beautifully said, Ms. Lundblom. You speak out so well!
Еxcuse me, I would like to get a reply for our letter “The letter from former Jehovah’s Witnesses from Russia”.
Why are you on this site?…. Im just interested to know your motivations …. and your personal experiences that led you to this forum.